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Camac
Posted: 01-Sep-2009, 07:11 PM
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Patch;

I just read your post about kids and weapons in school. Here( and I don't know how it got allowed) young Sikh boys are allowed to carry their Kirpans to school. A kirpan is a small dagger but is allowed as it falls under a religious item as it is part of Sikhism to carry the Kirpan as a sign of becoming a man and a warrior. I t must never be drawn except to defend but there has been a few incedents where it was used in a threatening manner. You see there are loopholes in Canada's Laws concerning weapons.


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flora 
Posted: 01-Sep-2009, 07:24 PM
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And confusion reigns:


Although Tennessee state legislators voted earlier this year to allow guns in all public parks, the law, which took effect Tuesday, has met some obstacles.

Mainly because 70 local governments have banned it.

That leaves questions about where park visitors can, or cannot, bring their guns.

Some park regulations, like Knoxville's Edgewood Park, are clear-cut.

"For at least the last 47 years, no guns have been allowed in any city park or recreation facility and that's still the case today," said Knoxville Vice Mayor Bob Becker.

Knoxville has had a public park gun ban since at least 1962. The new state law only affects local governments that did not have an ordinance prior to 1986.

However, figuring out where the gun ban applies in Knoxville can get trickier, because Knox County allows guns in parks, as it did not have an ordinance prior to 1986.

"There are alot of parks throughout our community and most people don't know the difference between a city and county park," said Knox County Parks and Recreation Senior Director Doug Bataille.

The Turkey Creek Greenway is a prime example. The path begins as Knoxville property -- no guns allowed -- but it runs through Knox County property, which allows guns. To make matters more confusing, the grenway eventually becomes Farragut land, which has a gun ban.

There are numerous other cases like it.

"I don't think we could sign that in a way that would be effective to let people know when you're on and off property. It would take hundreds of signs to do that," Bataille said.

Other issues include how to enforce the law when city or county property backs up to privately owned land, or when parks host public school athletic events.

"So, if you're allowed to bring guns into a park but not into a school event, how do we address that?" Bataille said.

Still, some lawmakers believe the policy works.

"I don't think this is that complicated an issue," Becker said.

Still, just like the laws themselves, opinions aren't uniform either.

"One of the concerns we have is having a policy that's the same across the community so park users know what to expect," Bataille said.

Knoxville City Council members and Knox County Commissioners are expected to again discuss the issue this month.

Flora



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Patch 
Posted: 01-Sep-2009, 07:47 PM
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Many states solved that problem by passing legislation that make state laws above those of localities. Some require a subsequent state supreme court ruling and it is then a done deal. It is reasonable in that federal law supersedes state and local law so state law should supersede local law.

It is a battle that is slowly being won. A couple of second amendment groups are considering whether to work in Tennessee to get a better law so I may be working there soon.

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Patch 
Posted: 08-Sep-2009, 12:38 PM
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I received this from GOA around noon today. and to think we believed V. Jones was nuts! This guy is a real piece of work!


Just when you thought the news about the Obama administration couldn't get any worse, gun owners find themselves needing to rally the troops once again.

This time it's the proposed "Regulatory Czar" who will be coming to a vote this week in the U.S. Senate.

His name is Cass Sunstein, and he holds some of the kookiest views you will ever hear.

For starters, Sunstein believes in regulating hunting out of existence. He told a Harvard audience in 2007 that "we ought to ban hunting." And in The Rights of Animals: A Very Short Primer (2002), he said:
I think we should go further ... the law should impose further regulation on hunting, scientific experiments, entertainment, and (above all) farming to ensure against unnecessary animal suffering. It is easy to imagine a set of initiatives that would do a great deal here, and indeed European nations have moved in just this direction. There are many possibilities. (Italics are his emphasis.) If that's all Sunstein believed, he would be dangerous and extreme, but not necessarily kooky. Unfortunately, when you look at WHY he wants to restrict hunting, this is where he goes beyond extreme.

In Sunstein's world, animals should have just as many rights as people ... and they should be able to sue humans in court!

"We could even grant animals a right to bring suit without insisting that animals are persons, or that they are not property," Sunstein said on page 11 of Animal Rights: Current Debates and New Directions (2004).

Well, that's a relief ... he is at least willing to concede that animals are not persons! But he would still have animals suing humans, apparently, with more enlightened humans representing the cuddly critters.

Imagine returning from a successful hunting trip ... only to find out that you've been subpoenaed for killing your prize. Who knows, maybe Sunstein would have the family of the dead animal serving as witnesses in court!

By the way, if you're wondering what he thinks about the Second Amendment right to keep and bear arms, you won't be surprised to know that Sunstein is a huge supporter of gun control.

In Radicals in Robes: Why Extreme Right-Wing Courts are Wrong for America (2005), Sunstein says:
Almost all gun control legislation is constitutionally fine.... [O]n the Constitution's text, fundamentalists [that is, gun rights supporters] should not be so confident in their enthusiasm for invalidating gun control legislation. Hmm, what part of "shall not be infringed" does Sunstein not understand?

Imagine the power that Sunstein could have as the Regulatory Czar -- the nickname for the person heading the Office of Information and Regulatory Affairs (OIRA) in the White House.

As the Regulatory Czar, he could bring about changes in the regulations that affect hunting, gun control and farming. In short, he could make your life hell.

Senator Saxby Chambliss (R-GA) objected to his nomination several weeks ago, preventing him from being unanimously confirmed.

That means that the Senate will now need to garner 60 votes to confirm this radical, kooky choice to the OIRA.

No doubt, many of the people our President wants to associate with are radical kooks. First, there was the Rev. Jeremiah Wright ... then there was the self-avowed communist (Van Jones) who was nominated for the Green Jobs Czar ... now, there's an extreme animal rights activist who wants to take away our guns and get Bambi to sue us in court.

Slàinte,    

Patch    
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Patch 
Posted: 08-Sep-2009, 12:48 PM
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QUOTE (Camac @ 01-Sep-2009, 08:11 PM)
Patch;

I just read your post about kids and weapons in school. Here( and I don't know how it got allowed) young Sikh boys are allowed to carry their Kirpans to school. A kirpan is a small dagger but is allowed as it falls under a religious item as it is part of Sikhism to carry the Kirpan as a sign of becoming a man and a warrior. I t must never be drawn except to defend but there has been a few incedents where it was used in a threatening manner. You see there are loopholes in Canada's Laws concerning weapons.


Camac

Here a metal fork or a butter knife (blunt) can get a kid expelled from school. Sometimes, even plastic tableware has been cause for expulsion. Even a small (1/2 in.) plastic copy of a gun on a key chain or a charm on a bracelet is cause for expulsion. That is part of the reason children are not being educated in the public system so much any longer. Private schools and home schooling are gaining ground fast. Especially as families have more time available. I believe if a person immigrates to another country, they must comply with the laws of that land, even if it goes against their religion. If religion is so important, GO HOME!

Slàinte,    

Patch    
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Camac
Posted: 08-Sep-2009, 01:49 PM
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Patch;

Under Canada's Charter of Rights and Freedoms concession on religious grounds have been made to Sikhs and other Religious groups. With the Sikhs its it their Turbans and Kirpans. The rules of the Legion state that one removes ones headgear upon entering the Hall as a sign of respect for the fallen. The Sikhs do not have to. Also if a Sikh becomes a member of the R.C.M.P. (Royal Canadian Mounted Police) he is allowed to wear his Turban rather than the Stetson worn by the force. We have strict gun laws but we allow so-clled religious weapons. Only in Canada.



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Patch 
Posted: 08-Sep-2009, 02:30 PM
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We do not make such concessions.

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flora 
Posted: 08-Sep-2009, 02:39 PM
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QUOTE (Patch @ 08-Sep-2009, 01:38 PM)
I received this from GOA around noon today. and to think we believed V. Jones was nuts! This guy is a real piece of work!


Just when you thought the news about the Obama administration couldn't get any worse, gun owners find themselves needing to rally the troops once again.

This time it's the proposed "Regulatory Czar" who will be coming to a vote this week in the U.S. Senate.

His name is Cass Sunstein, and he holds some of the kookiest views you will ever hear.

For starters, Sunstein believes in regulating hunting out of existence. He told a Harvard audience in 2007 that "we ought to ban hunting." And in The Rights of Animals: A Very Short Primer (2002), he said:
I think we should go further ... the law should impose further regulation on hunting, scientific experiments, entertainment, and (above all) farming to ensure against unnecessary animal suffering. It is easy to imagine a set of initiatives that would do a great deal here, and indeed European nations have moved in just this direction. There are many possibilities. (Italics are his emphasis.) If that's all Sunstein believed, he would be dangerous and extreme, but not necessarily kooky. Unfortunately, when you look at WHY he wants to restrict hunting, this is where he goes beyond extreme.

In Sunstein's world, animals should have just as many rights as people ... and they should be able to sue humans in court!

"We could even grant animals a right to bring suit without insisting that animals are persons, or that they are not property," Sunstein said on page 11 of Animal Rights: Current Debates and New Directions (2004).

Well, that's a relief ... he is at least willing to concede that animals are not persons! But he would still have animals suing humans, apparently, with more enlightened humans representing the cuddly critters.

Imagine returning from a successful hunting trip ... only to find out that you've been subpoenaed for killing your prize. Who knows, maybe Sunstein would have the family of the dead animal serving as witnesses in court!

By the way, if you're wondering what he thinks about the Second Amendment right to keep and bear arms, you won't be surprised to know that Sunstein is a huge supporter of gun control.

In Radicals in Robes: Why Extreme Right-Wing Courts are Wrong for America (2005), Sunstein says:
Almost all gun control legislation is constitutionally fine.... [O]n the Constitution's text, fundamentalists [that is, gun rights supporters] should not be so confident in their enthusiasm for invalidating gun control legislation. Hmm, what part of "shall not be infringed" does Sunstein not understand?

Imagine the power that Sunstein could have as the Regulatory Czar -- the nickname for the person heading the Office of Information and Regulatory Affairs (OIRA) in the White House.

As the Regulatory Czar, he could bring about changes in the regulations that affect hunting, gun control and farming. In short, he could make your life hell.

Senator Saxby Chambliss (R-GA) objected to his nomination several weeks ago, preventing him from being unanimously confirmed.

That means that the Senate will now need to garner 60 votes to confirm this radical, kooky choice to the OIRA.

No doubt, many of the people our President wants to associate with are radical kooks. First, there was the Rev. Jeremiah Wright ... then there was the self-avowed communist (Van Jones) who was nominated for the Green Jobs Czar ... now, there's an extreme animal rights activist who wants to take away our guns and get Bambi to sue us in court.

Slàinte,    

Patch    

wallbash.gif

Flora
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Patch 
Posted: 08-Sep-2009, 03:25 PM
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If you go to the following link there will be another link to contact your senators. By deleting the "certificate banner" three times you will not have to accept it.

http://gunowners.org

Slàinte,    

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Camac
Posted: 08-Sep-2009, 03:28 PM
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flora;

I agree this Sunsteen character is bonkers but I stand with him on banning Hunting. Specifically Sports Hunting. There is no need for the Big White Hunter armed with his semi-automatic cannon to be blasting away at animals in the wild.
If hunting is done to provide food, clothing, or other necessities for a family or individual that I will go along with. When the aboriginal peoples of North America or any other part of the world hunt it is to sustain life. For some so called sportsman to go out and shoot some animal just so he can hang it's head or antlers on a wall I personally think it is digusting. Well there is the argument that if we don't hunt them they will overpopulate. Thats what government culling programs are for.


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Patch 
Posted: 08-Sep-2009, 04:04 PM
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I know of no one who does not put the meat to use. It is illegal in the US and the parts of Canada I have hunted, to not save the meat. I will admit that bear meat gets tiring quick but there has never been a shortage of people willing to take it.

In your country the hunting $ brought in is a major source of income and no one legally hunts with a "semi- automatic cannon.

Here hunters that go for accuracy will not use a semi auto. I know one person who uses a semi auto because he lost an arm in Iraq and can not work a bolt or pump easily.

Slàinte,    

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flora 
Posted: 08-Sep-2009, 08:03 PM
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Camac, I think the most saddest instance I have known for an animal was while driving through one of the busiest sections of traffic in Atlanta, a deer had been hit but not killed and was laying beside the major highway suffering. Luckily a man who had a hand gun was able to put it out of its misery. They have to be culled and when the government does it, it is usually done by individual hunters on a lotto system.

I don't even like hunts that plant food to draw the animals. To me that is not real hunting. We use bows as much as a rifle. And like Patch I know of no one that waste the animal. That is one rule that we have in our family and we always stop and give thanks for the life of that animal.

You hear so much about the conditions of the cattle that we eat everyday, I believe hunting is more humane.

Flora
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Patch 
Posted: 09-Sep-2009, 07:32 AM
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I have been able to count three additional people I know who use a semi auto shotgun for wing shooting only. We are limited by law in waterfowl hunting to three shots and one pass of ducks or geese a day in this area is all one is likely to see, if that.

Personally I prefer my double in traditional side by side.

In hunting larger game, I can not recall when I have ever fired a second shot. If I knew I had not hit it well, I might but when in doubt, I do not shoot at all.

Slàinte,   

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Camac
Posted: 09-Sep-2009, 07:48 AM
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Patch;

You will take note that I said "SEMI-AUTOMATIC CANNON" as an exageration. The feeling about hunting is personal as other than with the aboriginal people I see absolutely no need for it. My step-father felt exactly the same way. He use to say :"I've been Hunted so I know what it feels like" He escaped 4 times from German POW camps, and was hunted down and returned. Also I know2 a little how it feels. Don't much like the sound of bullets whipping by my butt.



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Posted: 09-Sep-2009, 08:39 AM
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My military training was to hunt humans one on one.

In hunting I do not hunt just to kill an animal. I know of only a few that do and that is their meat supply. As often as not I shoot nothing. For most who hunt, the enjoyment is in the "hunt", not just the kill.

The anti hunting groups put out a lot of lies and the uninformed buy into it. I do not mean to imply that this is how you arrived at your decision. Chickens, sheep and hogs are probably the most inhumanely slaughtered animals as they must bleed out completely. A deer that is cleanly shot suffers much less than a hog sheep or chicken hung upside down while alive and with the hog and chicken, its neck or throat cut (there are several different ways) and with the sheep, it's head cut off. Of late hogs are stunned fist but many wake up and the squeals and screeches and the distinct smell of hog blood would put most "off" pork products forever. I grew up in the butcher business and worked with dad from a young age. That work conditioned me for lifes later events.

I respect those who do not wish to hunt but in return I expect the same.

My children and grandchildren have all been taught that it you hit a deer and can not find it, you tear off your tag and your season is over. My grandchildren have all made one shot kills and never wounded a deer. I am proud of them.

Slàinte,    

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