Welcome Guest ( Log In | Register )
   Mobile App






Forum Rules Enter at own risk!

The Philosophy, Science & Religion forum has been created as an unmoderated forum. The issues discussed here can and will get very intense. Please show respect and appreciation to alternative views posted here. We appreciate your consideration.

Reply to this topicStart new topicStart Poll

> Global Warming, Is it the end of the world?
Bookmark and Share
Nova Scotian 
Posted: 26-Mar-2007, 07:24 PM
Quote Post

Member is Offline



Celtic Guardian
Group Icon

Group: Scotland
Posts: 916
Joined: 09-Mar-2005
ZodiacRowan

Realm: Tampa Florida

male





QUOTE (stoirmeil @ 26-Mar-2007, 12:22 PM)
Yes, I suppose it is a "natural" thing that we behave like a highly evolved species that half the time creates the miraculous with our advanced development, and the other half the time runs destructively amok. It is just as natural, by this standard, given our proven capacity to alter our environment, that we recognize what a mess we have made on so many different fronts, and exert ourselves to correct it, instead of sitting there taking one day at a time, saying "Why worry? Life is as it should be." I find that dangerously passive. You say you have grandchildren?

Antwn -- What Al Gore does or does not do to practice what he preaches should not have all that much to do with our recognizing that the problem exists, and there is a narrow window of time to contemplate reversing or even slowing the melting of the polar ice before it isn't possible any more. Al Gore did not discover or invent the problem, he is just a spokesperson. If he has been opportunistic, or as NS loves to throw his favorite quasi-biblical word around, "hypocritical," it still does not alter the fact.

Boy Stoirmeil, laugh.gif laugh.gif laugh.gif quasi-biblical word? Hypocritical? You crack me up. laugh.gif I was just calling a spade a spade. So your are saying it's OK for him to not practice what he preaches?


--------------------
ALL4114Christ!

343 Their blood cries out! NEVER FORGET 9/11!

The 2nd Ammendment. The original Homeland Security!

"To those who would follow laws; laws need not apply. Those who would not follow laws; laws will have no affect upon."

Plato

I believe in Christianity as I believe that the sun has risen: not only because I see it, but because by it I see everything else.
C. S. Lewis
PMEmail Poster                
Top
John Clements 
Posted: 27-Mar-2007, 09:19 AM
Quote Post

Member is Offline



Celtic Guardian
********

Group: Celtic Nation
Posts: 1,466
Joined: 26-Oct-2005
ZodiacElder


male





QUOTE (stoirmeil @ 26-Mar-2007, 12:22 PM)
Yes, I suppose it is a "natural" thing that we behave like a highly evolved species that half the time creates the miraculous with our advanced development, and the other half the time runs destructively amok.  It is just as natural, by this standard, given our proven capacity to alter our environment, that we recognize what a mess we have made on so many different fronts, and exert ourselves to correct it, instead of sitting there taking one day at a time, saying "Why worry?  Life is as it should be."  I find that dangerously passive.  You say you have grandchildren? 

Antwn -- What Al Gore does or does not do to practice what he preaches should not have all that much to do with our recognizing that the problem exists, and there is a narrow window of time to contemplate reversing or even slowing the melting of the polar ice before it isn't possible any more.  Al Gore did not discover or invent the problem, he is just a spokesperson.  If he has been opportunistic, or as NS loves to throw his favorite quasi-biblical word around, "hypocritical," it still does not alter the fact.


You nailed it stoirmeil,

Although I would have just said that the truth hurts, and there for lets kill, or discredit the messenger. So calling Al Gore a hypocrite, because he uses more power then average household, is an absolute… knee “jerk” reaction to reality.

So when ever anyone one tells me, that they think that global-worming has been over exaggerated. I ask them to imagine seeing the tail pipe in their minds eye, and then I ask them to multiply that image… by billions.

So keep telling it like it is, even if it hurts, or you won’t be aloud to go to heaven.
JC


--------------------
We’re all poets, only some of us write it down. JC 9/27/08

Anyone who has the courage to disagree, deserves all do respect. JC 4/28/08

Life is a loosing battle, so you might as well live it up.
J.C. 3/29/08

Life should be like skiing, you have the most fun on the way down. J.C. 8/17/07

Take their word for it, and that’s just what you’ll get.
J.C. 3/19/07

Only the truth is worth the ultimate sacrifice.
J.C. 1/26/06

Compared to the far right, the far left is somewhere in the middle. J.C. 2/22/06

I’ll be the first to apologies, as long as I get one back.
J.C. 3/7/06

It’s a happy man, who can laugh at himself.

If you’re looking for a new experience, don’t hire someone with a lot of it. J.C. sometime in 1990
PMEmail Poster               
Top
stoirmeil 
Posted: 27-Mar-2007, 09:25 AM
Quote Post

Member is Offline



Celtic Guardian
********

Group: Celtic Nation
Posts: 3,581
Joined: 07-Nov-2004
ZodiacBirch

Realm: New York







QUOTE (Nova Scotian @ 26-Mar-2007, 07:24 PM)
So your are saying it's OK for him to not practice what he preaches?

If you read carefully, you will notice that what I said was:

"What Al Gore does or does not do to practice what he preaches should not have all that much to do with our recognizing that the problem exists, and there is a narrow window of time to contemplate reversing or even slowing the melting of the polar ice before it isn't possible any more."

This has nothing to do with it being "OK not to practice what he preaches."

But you don't read carefully.
PMEmail Poster               
Top
John Clements 
Posted: 27-Mar-2007, 09:37 AM
Quote Post

Member is Offline



Celtic Guardian
********

Group: Celtic Nation
Posts: 1,466
Joined: 26-Oct-2005
ZodiacElder


male





You nailed it stoirmeil,

Although I would have just said that the truth hurts, and there for lets kill, or discredit the messenger. So calling Al Gore a hypocrite, because he uses more power then average household is absolutely a knee “jerk” reaction to reality.

So when ever anyone one tells me that they think that global-worming has been over exaggerated. I ask them to imagine seeing the tail pipe in their minds eye, and then I ask them to multiply that image by, billions.

So keep telling it like it is, even if it hurts, or you won’t be aloud to go to heaven.
JC
PMEmail Poster               
Top
haynes9 
Posted: 27-Mar-2007, 09:56 AM
Quote Post

Member is Offline





Celtic Guardian
Group Icon

Group: Super Moderator
Posts: 10,843
Joined: 05-Jun-2005
ZodiacElder

Realm: Ganado, Navajo Nation, Arizona

male





Stormy, I understand where you are coming from, but look at it from this point of view.

As you know, I'm one of those wacky right wing preachers. (I feel like I should embrace the stereotype, not run from it wink.gif ) If I preach that a man should be faithful to his wife, what I do does not change the fact that this is true. I think we can all agree on that principal. However, would you not agree that the message loses it's potency if I, as the one conveying the truth, run around on my wife? No, it doesn't' change the truth, but how are my hearers going to react? They would think it is not as important an issue as I make it out to be since I don't practice what I preach.

I am not educated enough to know all the ins and outs of Global Warming. I think there are whack jobs on both sides of the issue, quite frankly. But, If Al Gore is the messenger, why am I supposed to think this is a serious issue if he does not put into practice what he says? It dilutes the message. If he really believes it is serious (and I am not saying he does not believe what he is saying) then why not demonstrate it in his lifestyle instead of tying to get everyone else to do so?

Not trying to be contentious, just asking some questions. Have a great day!


--------------------
Always vote for principle, though you may vote alone, and you may cherish the sweetest reflection that your vote is never lost. -- John Quincy Adams

Do your duty in all things. You cannot do more, you should never wish to do less - Robert E. Lee

For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved - Romans 10:13 (KJV)

The Lord is good, a strong hold in the day of trouble, and he knoweth them that trust in him - Nahum 1:7 (KJV)
PMEmail PosterUsers WebsiteMy Photo Album               
Top
stoirmeil 
Posted: 27-Mar-2007, 12:14 PM
Quote Post

Member is Offline



Celtic Guardian
********

Group: Celtic Nation
Posts: 3,581
Joined: 07-Nov-2004
ZodiacBirch

Realm: New York







This is a matter of having some mental independence and being able to separate the message from the messenger. Some time before adolescence you learned the limitations of the ubiquitous parental "Don't do as I do -- do as I say." And you learned to move beyond it to find the right way to behave, irrespective of the inconsistencies of the one socializing you. You can't lay it on anyone else.

I'm sorry -- I do not excuse any fully functioning adult from the responsibility of discriminating between message and messenger, explanation and excuse. If a pimp comes into the room with a prostitute on each arm and tells you about the dangers of sexually transmitted diseases, it does not dilute the truth of the message one iota. Sorry if the analogy offends anyone. And it is just an analogy, and not a snarky description of anyone we are or are not approving of at the moment. That's another distinction that needs a little working.
PMEmail Poster               
Top
haynes9 
Posted: 27-Mar-2007, 12:19 PM
Quote Post

Member is Offline





Celtic Guardian
Group Icon

Group: Super Moderator
Posts: 10,843
Joined: 05-Jun-2005
ZodiacElder

Realm: Ganado, Navajo Nation, Arizona

male





Appreciate the condescending tone, Stormy. It's always such a joy to be able to engage in civil discussion.

Have a great day.
PMEmail PosterUsers WebsiteMy Photo Album               
Top
stoirmeil 
Posted: 28-Mar-2007, 09:08 AM
Quote Post

Member is Offline



Celtic Guardian
********

Group: Celtic Nation
Posts: 3,581
Joined: 07-Nov-2004
ZodiacBirch

Realm: New York







QUOTE (haynes9 @ 27-Mar-2007, 12:19 PM)
Appreciate the condescending tone, Stormy. It's always such a joy to be able to engage in civil discussion.

Have a great day.

Well, haynes, that's just a sarcastic response to condescension, as you seem to have perceived my words, including the "have a great day." And that's regrettable, because even though I spoke strongly and out of a good deal of exasperation, it was certainly not aimed at you personally. If I provoked you into departing from your usual and much needed position as peacemaker, I am genuinely sorry.

That said -- I regret the tone if it offended, but I still stand by what I said about not automatically judging the message by its envelope.
PMEmail Poster               
Top
John Clements 
Posted: 28-Mar-2007, 09:43 AM
Quote Post

Member is Offline



Celtic Guardian
********

Group: Celtic Nation
Posts: 1,466
Joined: 26-Oct-2005
ZodiacElder


male





I stand with you stoirmeil, right down to the… “Have a great day?”
JC
PMEmail Poster               
Top
haynes9 
Posted: 28-Mar-2007, 10:47 AM
Quote Post

Member is Offline





Celtic Guardian
Group Icon

Group: Super Moderator
Posts: 10,843
Joined: 05-Jun-2005
ZodiacElder

Realm: Ganado, Navajo Nation, Arizona

male





QUOTE (stoirmeil @ 28-Mar-2007, 08:08 AM)
QUOTE (haynes9 @ 27-Mar-2007, 12:19 PM)
Appreciate the condescending tone, Stormy. It's always such a joy to be able to engage in civil discussion.

Have a great day.

Well, haynes, that's just a sarcastic response to condescension, as you seem to have perceived my words, including the "have a great day." And that's regrettable, because even though I spoke strongly and out of a good deal of exasperation, it was certainly not aimed at you personally. If I provoked you into departing from your usual and much needed position as peacemaker, I am genuinely sorry.

That said -- I regret the tone if it offended, but I still stand by what I said about not automatically judging the message by its envelope.

Stormy and John,

Forget it. It was my bad. I was the one out of line. bash.gif

I still believe that the message is best conveyed through a messenger that backs it up with his/her life, but my response was moronic. Very sorry about that. New day and I'll try and be more "in tune" with my responses. Don't always agree with you two, but I respect you both.

Have a great day (Really!).
PMEmail PosterUsers WebsiteMy Photo Album               
Top
Antwn 
Posted: 28-Mar-2007, 11:46 AM
Quote Post

Member is Offline



Celtic Guardian
********

Group: Celtic Nation
Posts: 1,409
Joined: 18-Apr-2005
ZodiacBirch

Realm: UDA ond o linach Cymry

male





QUOTE (stoirmeil @ 26-Mar-2007, 12:22 PM)
Antwn -- What Al Gore does or does not do to practice what he preaches should not have all that much to do with our recognizing that the problem exists, and there is a narrow window of time to contemplate reversing or even slowing the melting of the polar ice before it isn't possible any more.  Al Gore did not discover or invent the problem, he is just a spokesperson.  If he has been opportunistic, or as NS loves to throw his favorite quasi-biblical word around, "hypocritical," it still does not alter the fact.

Does a problem exist? What exactly is it? Is the polar ice melting? Is there a narrow window of time to correct the situation? Antarctic ice is only melting over water and getting thicker over land. The same is happening in Greenland, which might seem to indicate that the oceans are getting warmer, a different situation from the escalation of the greenhouse effect so relentlessly touted.

Gore didn't discover a problem at all, he's prosthelytising misinformation and profiting off of it. Anthropogenic global warming by C02 and other greenhouse gas emissions is unproven and highly suspect. Even the IPCC reports express uncertainties about correlations between C02 and warming. C02 is not a "pollutant" as Gore endlessly reiterates and humans contribute about 3-4% of the total atmospheric C02 yearly. The rest is caused naturally. The highest concentrations of C02 ever recorded have occurred during an ice age, according to deep core drilling. What does that say about the correlation between C02 and warming? Is warming happening? Is it anthropogenic?

Gore relies on long term projections from computer modeling, a technique whose reliability is so trusted that your local weatherman won't use it to predict beyond 10 days reliably.

What's sad is that Gore is sensationalising unproven postulates, relying on only one set of opinions, ignoring highly pertinent facts because they don't fit his apocalyptic paradigm, misleading the public with unsubstantiated doom scenarios and is making a killing off of it. You're right, not practicing what he preaches is the least of his transgressions.

Information is out there which completely contradicts Gore's assertions which is ignored. Gore of course can't be bothered by facts when there are accolades and money to be had. Even if his motives are sincere, then he's certainly guilty of extremely faulty research. Yet if his research had been more complete, it would have deflated the hyperbolic fantasies he's relied on.



--------------------
Yr hen Gymraeg i mi,
Hon ydyw iaith teimladau,
Ac adlais i guriadau
Fy nghalon ydyw hi
--- Mynyddog
PMEmail Poster               
Top
dundee 
Posted: 28-Mar-2007, 04:19 PM
Quote Post

Member is Offline



Celtic Guardian
Group Icon

Group: Scotland
Posts: 1,170
Joined: 01-Aug-2003
ZodiacReed


male





here is something i got off the internet. the original site is http://www.canadafreepress.com/2006/harris061206.htm

the rest were the links in the article i believe read it for yourself.

excerpt

Professor Bob Carter of the Marine Geophysical Laboratory at James Cook University, in Australia gives what, for many Canadians, is a surprising assessment: "Gore's circumstantial arguments are so weak that they are pathetic. It is simply incredible that they, and his film, are commanding public attention."

....Carter is one of hundreds of highly qualified non-governmental, non-industry, non-lobby group climate experts who contest the hypothesis that human emissions of carbon dioxide (CO2) are causing significant global climate change. "Climate experts" is the operative term here. Why? Because what Gore's "majority of scientists" think is immaterial when only a very small fraction of them actually work in the climate field.

brrrrr i am chilly... *gets sweater*


Attached File The_Inconvenient_Truth.doc
Size: 47K
Number of downloads: 48 Times(s)
Last accessed: 25-Nov-2014, 01:59 PM
Last Updated: 28-Mar-2007, 04:19 PM


--------------------
jim

www.greyaengus.com

"If I say something that can be interpreted in two ways, and one of the ways makes you sad or angry, I meant it the other way."

often in error, never in doubt.

if guns kill people then my pencil mis-spells words
quote: larry the cable guy

sometimes what ya think ya want
isnt what ya thought ya wanted
till ya get what ya thought ya wanted
and then what ya had is gone....
PMEmail PosterUsers WebsiteMy Photo Album               
Top
stoirmeil 
Posted: 28-Mar-2007, 07:54 PM
Quote Post

Member is Offline



Celtic Guardian
********

Group: Celtic Nation
Posts: 3,581
Joined: 07-Nov-2004
ZodiacBirch

Realm: New York







Antwn -- fair enough. There's a university level earth and atmospheric sciences department with some heavy-hitting researchers in it, not fifty feet from my office door at my job -- I do curriculum advising and graduation audits with science undergrads, in addition to teaching psychology, as my daily work and I run into these guys all the time. I will take a poll among some of the professors, as well as collecting some current research citations from them, and get back to y'all. I think this is fair, since I am taking a definite side in this discussion. May not be tomorrow, as we are just starting spring break, and a lot of faculty and staff (including me) will be out for the next ten days. I hope you don't mind if I share your post with them, instead of trying to remember it.

I doubt that Gore is doing his own primary research on any deep level -- he hasn't got the training for that, and he must be relying on reports and having them interpreted for him by qualified people, if he is on the up and up. In any case it isn't Gore I take my cues from on this issue -- I didn't even see the film. But I'm still not willing to say he's just exploiting a bully pulpit and letting off a cloud of methane without a lot more damning evidence.

haynes -- My response was stronger in tone than it needed to be, it ticked you off understandably, I should have tempered it, and there's no need to apologize.
PMEmail Poster               
Top
John Clements 
Posted: 29-Mar-2007, 06:54 AM
Quote Post

Member is Offline



Celtic Guardian
********

Group: Celtic Nation
Posts: 1,466
Joined: 26-Oct-2005
ZodiacElder


male





Hi Dundee, just like you and I, scientists have been disagreeing from the beginning. So it always comes down to who you agree with. Or, for that matter, who you think is telling the truth.

So why don’t we conduct our own scientific experiment. Let’s say… foe example. You sit in a running car, in closed garage. And of course the conclusion we’re looking for is… How long do you think they would last?

What I’m saying is, we’re poising the air 24-7, so, even if Gore is exaggerating about global worming. I think that he deserves every single cent he’s made, don’t you?

-----

Antwn, I’m sorry but I have to say this. The last two paragraphs of your post on this subject, sounds an awful lot… like the BS… that got us into the Iraq debacle.

Just like malice, blind faith and ignorance, kills too.
JC
PMEmail Poster               
Top
haynes9 
Posted: 29-Mar-2007, 08:16 AM
Quote Post

Member is Offline





Celtic Guardian
Group Icon

Group: Super Moderator
Posts: 10,843
Joined: 05-Jun-2005
ZodiacElder

Realm: Ganado, Navajo Nation, Arizona

male





QUOTE (John Clements @ 29-Mar-2007, 05:54 AM)
Hi Dundee, just like you and I, scientists have been disagreeing from the beginning. So it always comes down to who you agree with. Or, for that matter, who you think is telling the truth.

That's the problem here, John. There are scientists, equally qualified on both sides, who say opposite things. Thee are also hacks on each side who would sell out in a heartbeat for any agenda that would benefit them personally. You are right in that it comes down to who you want to believe, unless one is willing to put in a lot of time into personal research.

Not sure the enclosed garage is a good analogy. Obviously, man should be responsible in his handling of the earth's resources, but this old planet is amazing in the way it replenishes itself. There is a huge difference between a wooden enclosure and the atmosphere, although I see where you are coming from in the analogy.
Until politics is removed rolleyes.gif and scientists approach this issue non-agenda driven, it's going to be difficult to determine the truth of the matter.
PMEmail PosterUsers WebsiteMy Photo Album               
Top
0 User(s) are reading this topic (0 Guests and 0 Anonymous Users)
0 Members:

Reply to this topicStart new topicStart Poll

 








Celtic RadioTM broadcasts through Live365.com and StreamLicensing.com which are officially licensed under SoundExchange, ASCAP, BMI, SESAC and SOCAN.
©2014 Celtic Radio Network, Highlander Radio, Celtic Moon, Celtic Dance, Ye O' Celtic Pub and Celt-Rock-Radio.
All rights and trademarks reserved. Read our Privacy Policy.
Celtic Graphics ©2014, Cari Buziak


Link to CelticRadio.net!
Link to CelticRadio.net
View Broadcast Status and Statistics!

Best Viewed With IE 8.0 (1680 x 1050 Resolution), Javascript & Cookies Enabled.


[Home] [Top]

Celtic Hearts Gallery | Celtic Mates Dating | My Celtic Friends | Celtic Music Radio | Family Heraldry | Medival Kingdom | Top Celtic Sites | Web Celt Blog | Video Celt