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Should we do more in memorial to Confederate Soliders?
Yes. [ 53 ]  [65.43%]
No. [ 28 ]  [34.57%]
Total Votes: 81
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Annabelle 
Posted on 24-Nov-2003, 11:04 AM
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Pagan it would be nice if we all lived in never never land and we all had glass houses but war is war...and it always comes down to money

one of the biggest mis-givings you have is the fact that you think everyone values life like you do..I wish everyone did but they don't..

As for getting back to the subject of the Confederate War I still think all people who die for our country deserve to be remembered...

Annabelle


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barddas 
Posted on 24-Nov-2003, 11:22 AM
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Nicely said Pagan.
Everyone says "oh, we want a peaceful world"...... "war is Hell"...Blah, blah, blah!!!!
I agree if people actually practiced what they preach, maybe the world would be in a different situation. Instead of teaching thier kids, they sit them infront of the tele, and that's most of the parenting skills they achieve.

I think we have gone round and round with this topic... and are begining to beat the horse...MOST of us agree that MOST American soldiers deserve to be remembered....



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High Plains Drifter 
Posted on 24-Nov-2003, 11:51 AM
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If you go to nearly any County Court House in the South, you will find some sort of memorial to Confederate Soldiers. I do not have a problem with this but I cannot speak for African-Americans. Although slavery was only one of several issues that led up to the War, the Confederate Battle Flag and the Confederacy as a whole has become a symbol adopted by many white supremacist groups. I feel any 21st Century efforts to memorialize Confederate Soldiers any further would add to the racial decisiveness that exists in thes country.


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Annabelle 
Posted on 24-Nov-2003, 12:38 PM
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Racial decisiveness is garbage.

I can't do anything about people who use the Rebel Flag for their own purposes as with White Supremeists groups... also I can't do anything about people who wear a stick on their shoulder label "racist" and walk around asking others to knock it off...it's their problem that they can't go forward...

All other Ethnic Groups who came to America got on with living....other's need to learn to do the same instead of asking us to knock it off...how long do we succumb to this?

I never owned a slave and if I did he'd be in a kilt, long blonde hair with a great body and be serving me drinks out by the pool.

This world will never be perfect....and we don't live in a glass house..wake up folks! Never Never land doesn't exist! But I wish it did!

Annabelle
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Annabelle 
Posted on 24-Nov-2003, 12:47 PM
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Maybe the original slaves should be paid "reparations" not to their descendants but to African American's who were slaves during the Civil War?

They did for the Japanese who were put in concentration camps during the war. Do you think there's anyone alive? Hummm...

Annabelle
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barddas 
Posted on 24-Nov-2003, 01:04 PM
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QUOTE (Annabelle @ Nov 24 2003, 01:38 PM)


This world will never be perfect....and we don't live in a glass house..wake up folks! Never Never land doesn't exist! But I wish it did!

Annabelle




And thinking like that won't make it ANY better. Maybe a bit of reality . Sure, I know *nothing* is perfect. But if anyone isn't willing to change it or at LEAST try..... then don't bitch about the imperfections of the world.
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Mailagnas maqqas Dunaidonas 
Posted on 24-Nov-2003, 01:06 PM
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QUOTE
Racial decisiveness is garbage.

I agree with Annabelle, and would add that I sometimes wonder whether some civil rights groups aren't doing such things as starting fights over displays of the CSA Battle Flag to cover up the true strides that have been made in achieving racial and gender equality, strides that might well endanger the continuing "need" for the existence of such groups. Here in Rochester, NY, we have an extemely popular black mayor, a Democrat with an Urban League background, who I sometimes think is a closet Libertarian, given his willingness to judge each person on the person's own merits, without regard to race, etc. His message is that self-help will get you a lot further than a hand-out. He is one of the few Democrats I have ever voted for. I have no doubt that there are other black politicians around the country being elected for the same reason.
I sometimes think the only group left that can be openly discriminated against is white Catholic males, as I discovered when my son, a graduate of a Jesuit High School, was considering applying to some Ivy League schools, only to discover that Jesuit graduates were less than welcome--but that is getting way too far afield from the scope of this thread, and probably out of scope for this forum.


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Annabelle 
Posted on 24-Nov-2003, 02:02 PM
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Thanks Mailagnas!
Annabelle
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Annabelle 
Posted on 24-Nov-2003, 02:03 PM
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I hate people who run around screaming "I've been persecuted", well get over it, who hasen't!
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Therasa 
Posted on 29-Nov-2003, 09:10 AM
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I am going to add my two cents to this without starting any fights. ( I hope)

I have read all of the comments here. And as I am only human, the first thing is, I hate war, I hate blood shed. Secondly though, most of the battles, I understand. Others, I really don't understand what the heck people were thinking.
(I never have been in the military in anyway, that being said, all of my comments are from a civilian.) I have only watched history shows about these battles and really, I just can't believe what one human can do to another.

I would like to see all of man kind be able to love one another, embrace our differences if you will. Obviously hasn't happened, probably never will. But I do think we can be a bit more tolerant. Kids show more respect on a whole, that adults do. But, that being said, these kids can never of seen war. Kids that see it, live it, grow up and do it all over again. That is the cycle we have to break. But I really don't see a way to do it.

I have the names of family on several plaques around this world. And I am proud of them. I know that they fought for what they believed in. I may not agree with what they believed in, but I must give respect for the fact that they had enough guts to try. I don't know many people that would.

The battles of the past, I'm sorry. I think were alot harder than they are now. Yes, everyone bleeds. But in the beginning, you needed to look into your enemies eyes. You needed to be face to face with him. Not 100 miles away in an armoured tank. (not that now is any less dangerous. )

So I do believe all soldiers, all men and women who have stood up for their rights, beliefs and honor, deserve the respect that they fought so hard for.

Sorry for the rant.


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CelticRadio 
Posted on 30-Nov-2003, 08:33 AM
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QUOTE (Annabelle @ Nov 24 2003, 01:47 PM)
Maybe the original slaves should be paid "reparations" not to their descendants but to African American's who were slaves during the Civil War?

They did for the Japanese who were put in concentration camps during the war. Do you think there's anyone alive? Hummm...

Annabelle

I'd like to get something for repayment of my ancestor who was most likely kicked out of Scotland to make room for sheep grazing. Or what about Jewish people who were enslaved 2000 years ago; or what about the girls in Eastern Europe that are being enslaved in a life of prositition. Is anybody doing something to repay them.

The blood of 600,000 Americans fought and died and freed the slaves of the south. Mangled and torn apart they gave their lives for the sake of freedom. Don't talk to me about repayment. History has been brutal and cruel. It's time we all moved on to higher standards than to waste are time making amends for the past wrong doings of DEAD people.

I think the best you can do is honor ALL people of that time period because it was really one of the few times in recent history where the future was up for grabs. The Civil War and WWII are two times where the outcome would have us living completely different lives today. Let us not forgot the lessons of the past. That too me is not living in a glass house!


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CelticRadio 
Posted on 30-Nov-2003, 08:37 AM
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A picture of 2 of my kids on the round tops at Gettysburg. To the left in the background is devils den; two the far left out of the picture was lil round top where the Maine held the union flank. I could not imagine ever making a charge up those hills in the face of certain death.

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Mailagnas maqqas Dunaidonas 
Posted on 30-Nov-2003, 08:58 AM
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MacFive,
Nice picture! Devil's Den and Little Round Top are areas I've become familiar with over the past few years. I've made several trips to Gettysburg as an adult advisor for my daughter's BSA Venturing Crew, which specializes in Civil War Re-enacting. So, we go there quite often at the beginning of July, and also for Remembrance Day in November.
The first time we visited Devil's Den, it had a very strong attraction for my daughter that she had a difficult time explaining. Similarly, we had a hard time leaving Culp's Hill.
A year or so later, after I started researching our family's own WTBS ties, I discovered that a distant cousin Thomas Lewis Ware, of the 15 GA (whose diary was incorporated in the book "35 Days to Gettysburg") had died during the Confederate attack on Devil's Den. I also discovered that a unit in which many of our ancestors served, the 48th Virginia Infantry, was heavily involved in the attach on Culp's Hill.
I have also walked the route of Pickett's Charge with other descendant's on July 3 at the precise time of the Charge. It's the only time all year the Park Service allows us to carry Battle Flags and weapons. It's another very emotional experience. One year, a member of my unit who portrays his chaplain ancestor gave a talk that had a CNN cameraman wiping away tears.
Many other people have had similar experiences. Whether you visit once or many times, it is hard not to be affected.
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CelticRadio 
Posted on 30-Nov-2003, 09:16 AM
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QUOTE (Mailagnas maqqas Dunaidonas @ Nov 30 2003, 09:58 AM)
MacFive,
Nice picture! Devil's Den and Little Round Top are areas I've become familiar with over the past few years. I've made several trips to Gettysburg as an adult advisor for my daughter's BSA Venturing Crew, which specializes in Civil War Re-enacting. So, we go there quite often at the beginning of July, and also for Remembrance Day in November.
The first time we visited Devil's Den, it had a very strong attraction for my daughter that she had a difficult time explaining. Similarly, we had a hard time leaving Culp's Hill.
A year or so later, after I started researching our family's own WTBS ties, I discovered that a distant cousin Thomas Lewis Ware, of the 15 GA (whose diary was incorporated in the book "35 Days to Gettysburg") had died during the Confederate attack on Devil's Den. I also discovered that a unit in which many of our ancestors served, the 48th Virginia Infantry, was heavily involved in the attach on Culp's Hill.
I have also walked the route of Pickett's Charge with other descendant's on July 3 at the precise time of the Charge. It's the only time all year the Park Service allows us to carry Battle Flags and weapons. It's another very emotional experience. One year, a member of my unit who portrays his chaplain ancestor gave a talk that had a CNN cameraman wiping away tears.
Many other people have had similar experiences. Whether you visit once or many times, it is hard not to be affected.

You said this in words which I have been trying to describe to people. It really is an emotional experience that you can not quite explain.

I have my own 'unexplained' story while driving through the battlefield park; before the roundtops; I pulled over to read a statue and was inexplicitly drawn to an old statue about 50-70 feet away just after the clearing in the forest. Not having alot of time, we could not get out of the car for each stop, but I was entranced with the statute to the back. I myself jumped out of our van and walked to the back of the clearing and when I reached the statute it was for the Massachusetts Volunteers. (My family and ancestors come from Mass.). It was almost like I was guided to that spot and read the memorial.

We stayed at General Rober E. Lee's Headquarters; right on the battlefield. I highly recommend this hotel as it is very close to the battlefield and away from the center of the busy town.

Thanks for sharing your story!
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Eamon 
Posted on 16-Dec-2003, 03:24 PM
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Again I am late on a posting! Since I just joined in the begining of December, I hope you will all forgive me. Anyhow, I re-enacted CW for 10 years and agree with Paul completly. I will let his words speak for me.

"I think the best you can do is honor ALL people of that time period because it was really one of the few times in recent history where the future was up for grabs. The Civil War and WWII are two times where the outcome would have us living completely different lives today. Let us not forgot the lessons of the past. That to me is not living in a glass house!"

Paul, if you ever head out to Gettysburg again, and you want an insiders tour, let me know. I have spent entirely too much time there (and have been thrown out of that Irish bar a few times as well!)

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