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Should we do more in memorial to Confederate Soliders?
Yes. [ 53 ]  [65.43%]
No. [ 28 ]  [34.57%]
Total Votes: 81
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CelticRadio 
Posted on 11-Nov-2003, 06:55 PM
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On this Veterans day I thought it might be interesting to get peoples feelings on the status of the memorials for Confederate soldiers who died during the Civil War. Seems to me that lately there is a push to completely wipe the culture of the south and of the Confederacy completely from our society. School names that have stood for a hundred years are being changed from famous leaders of the South during the Civil War.

Many people in the Civil War had no choice which side they fought on - North or South - it was a matter of what boat they took from Ireland, England or Scotland on where they landed and where they fought. My ancestor who immigrated from Scotland was headed to North Carolina - he ended up shipwrecked off the coast of PEI. Perhaps I would not be here today if he had landed at his destination.

It is not my intent to bring up the issue of Slavery. That to me, whether it was in America, in England, in Germany or in Egypt was wrong and there is no question about that. My real intent of this post is to ponder the question if confederate soliders are honored and memorialized less than their union counterparts.


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kidclaymore 
Posted on 11-Nov-2003, 07:21 PM
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I think we should honor the confederate soldiers, not because I live in the south,and have all my life, but because for right or wrong they fought for what they belived. They were all americans.


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kidclaymore 
Posted on 11-Nov-2003, 07:50 PM
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I just had an argument with my wife over this topic. She doesn't think we should honor this soldiers because they fought for slavery. But as I said before they fought for what they thought was right. It doesn't matter what war they fought in whether it was the civil war, WW1, WW2, Vietnam, or the Gulf war, they deserve to be honored.
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Elspeth 
Posted on 11-Nov-2003, 09:57 PM
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Gee, kid, hope you're not sleeping on the couch over this one. laugh.gif

Being a Northerner, I have to say I'm a bit of a sucker for the romanticism of the whole 'lost cause' ideal.

But that aside, to do anything other than present the entire story is wrong. I want my children to learn the entire truths of history, not just the comfortable ones.

We were a country divided over some fundamental ideals. And there were significant reasons for that division, otherwise a war wouldn't have been fought over it. And there were many, many reasons other than slavery. I don't know the stats, but I would venture to guess the vast majority of those fighting for the Confederacy never owned a slave in their life. And more than likely didn't particularily condone slavery.

Somewhere recently the question was raised if America had ever been under siege or occupied. The easy answer was no. The response was tell that to a southerner.

Those monuments and names are part of the culture and should remain. In 1861, men went to war. Considering the education of the times, I would have to guess most had only a slight idea of what the 'cause' was. The did what they were told was their duty.

Where I live many places, rivers, etc. are named after the Native peoples who first lived here. I know it isn't comparing apples to apples, but what if some day it became no longer 'pc' to use those names. And everything was changed to 'white bread' names. (meaning, bland, boring and safe) Is it ever all right to just ignore entire sections of our history and heritage?

The Civil War happened and every man who fought did what he felt to be his duty should be honored for that.

I don't mean to stir any international waters, but I wonder if any of those living in Germany can tell us how those who fought in WWII are honored. For to say that Confederate soldiers shouldn't be honored because they fought for slavery seems similiar to saying those German soldiers who fought in WWII shouldn't be honored because they fought for the Holocaust.

Nothing is ever that simple. Most conflicts are decided upon by a handful of men (and now women too). Those who do the fighting and the dying are only doing what has been asked of them. They don't get to decide. They can only pray their leaders know what they are doing.

Sorry, long answer. But to be honest, I'd rather my child went to a high school named after Jefferson Davis than William Jefferson Clinton. (sorry, editorializing and being flip)

However, I don't know that it is appropriate to have a flag displayed in public buildings that represents oppression to many. Or public buildings named after those seen as the leaders of that oppression. Would it be appropriate to expect Jews to attend Himmler High in Germany? From that standpoint I can understand the push for change.

Sorry, I just argued both sides of the coin.


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andylucy 
Posted on 12-Nov-2003, 12:37 AM
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QUOTE (kidclaymore @ Nov 11 2003, 06:50 PM)
She doesn't think we should honor this soldiers because they fought for slavery. But as I said before they fought for what they thought was right.


Exactly right. My great x3 grandfather fought with the 3rd Kentucky. He was not a slave owner. He didn't know anyone who was a slave owner. For these guys, the fight was over the level of Federal control over state governments. They fought for what they believed to be right.

They should be honored, as should the British and German troops who fell during the American War of Independence and the War of 1812. The troops should be honored for their sacrifice, even though (to the best of my recollection) no English, Scottish, Welsh or Irish Regiment in existence today has any battle honors from these two conflicts on their colours.


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silverdragon 
Posted on 12-Nov-2003, 12:47 AM
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Hmmm... and I dared to be amused today by songs of the old Argyle-MacDonald feud. unsure.gif I forgot for a moment that we in the States have our own old open wounds.


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TheCarolinaScotsman 
Posted on 12-Nov-2003, 02:49 AM
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Yes, we should honor our confederate soldiers. Most were fighting, not for slavery, but for their state, which, in the south was considered a soverign entity in free association with other states. Most southerners were not slave owners. All of my ancestors were from North or South Carolina; none had slaves; in fact, most thought slavery was evil, but they fought for the south. Four great-grandfathers, three gg-grandfathers, numerous "cousins" and "uncles". Some killed, many wounded, some taken POW. All were honorable men fighting to protect their "homeland". Later generations descended from this noble group of men were threatened by the KKK because of their stand on civil rights. The same family, the same values. War is almost always evil, and there are always some on both sides who wallow in that evil, but the men who fight for their homes, families and country should be remembered and honored.


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Arianrhod 
Posted on 12-Nov-2003, 08:11 AM
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Being first Generation myself.. angel_not.gif
I feel like perhaps, I really shouldnt say anything here......
But then, I share my life and home with a 100% Scot , born and raised in N Carolina , who served his Country in the Coast Guard for 12 years..
You can imagine the dinner conversation wink.gif ..

I have to say yes here.. and I do think the slavery issue muddies the waters..
I feel these men were fighting for hearth and home !
More so than any politcal agenda..

At Tartan day this year, it was my pleasure to hear a re enactor , tell the story of one of the Scottish Regimines march from Carlise to Fort Pitt, places I can pass on any given day .. I wish I had taped this man, he was fantastic ... and I wish you all could hear him.. his first party rendition of how it all happened, was facinating..
So much more so then from out of a book..

Growing up around places like Fort Ligoner, and Fort Pitt. gave me a sense of history , hearing this man speak, let me live a small peice of it..

Even going to The Pennsic war, and living in the Middle Ages for two weeks a year.
It gives you an IDEA of what it was like, but , we know, at the end of the day, anyone slain on the feild that day, will be dancing and drinking that night smile.gif
And that we go back to flush toilets and air conditioning, and all the other modern conveniences of the 20th Century ..
Its a vacation... after hearing that man speak, I will never gripe about anything at Pennsic again ...

ALL of these men deserve honor .. in my eyes ..

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kidclaymore 
Posted on 12-Nov-2003, 05:34 PM
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Well said, Gang. No I'm not sleeping on the couch, We have been married for a long time and don't let such things as this, get to us.
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maryellen 
Posted on 12-Nov-2003, 08:46 PM
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To dispute most high school history texts, the Civil War was not based on slavary, but political moves when incorporating new states into the union.
I don't think that those that fought for evil should be honored. Those that fought for their homes, for freedom and for good should be honored no matter which side they were on. I know I disagree with a lot of you, thats just how I see it.


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barddas 
Posted on 13-Nov-2003, 10:55 AM
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The war between the states was only partially about slavery. It was also about states rights as well.
They were Americans. North or south. That doesn't matter. Like Mcfive said, alot of those boys fighting depended on where they got of the ship and were drafted.
I know it's a touchy subject. It's an ugly thing. But no one complains about the Romans having slaves, or that the English owned slaves... At one point in history someone was a slave to someone else. Color isn't the issue.... it is the human right. None of us were there so we can only read a biaised version of it anyway.....


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barddas 
Posted on 13-Nov-2003, 10:59 AM
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This just jumped into my head.... The focus on the war between the states has always been taught as slavery.... but what about all of the Native Americans that were slaughtered during/after the war in the plains.... nobody ever speaks/or teaches of that ... Now that is what I see as "evil"
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RavenWing 
Posted on 13-Nov-2003, 03:55 PM
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too true, Jason cry.gif


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Arianrhod 
Posted on 13-Nov-2003, 10:34 PM
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Heh , Jason , is there room on that soap box ?

That is an issue near and dear to my heart..
How the natives of this land were treated ....
I agree it was pure evil....

Slavery was the reason kids were spoon fed in history class , for what the war was about ....They say all news is bias, I think, that can be said for any written word .

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barddas 
Posted on 14-Nov-2003, 08:54 AM
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I think it can be non biased if both sides are studied and a rounded conclusion can be obtained.

As long as someone doesn't become emotionally attached to the issue.... Hard thing to do sometimes....

And yes, there is always room on the soapbox.... Just set yer coat over there--------->

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