Where Did It All Start., Blugrass music and it's roots.

A co-worker introduced me to "Whiskey Lullaby", and I have fallen in love. The story is similar in many ways to that told in such places as "One Last Cold Kiss", "Anachie Gordon", The end of Shakesphere's "Romeo & Juliet", and several others, of one lover killing themselves on behalf of the other's death. Brad Paisley and Allison Krauss do a wonderful job with it, although I was just thinking on the way home from work... How would it sound played on Tin Whistle? I bet it would really be enchanting. I don't yet actually know any tunes for Whistle, but I wonder if I could learn this and try it....

Shamrock

To answer your question about the instruments of Bluegrass and their origin.

The guitar and all of it's variations, (i.e. the resonator - the squareneck version being the variety found in Bluegrass music) is decidedly American and can be traced back to the mid 1800's

The banjo is originally from Africa and it is my understanding that it came by way of Ireland to the U.S. in it's tenor version. The modern bluegrass banjo with 5 strings and tone ring are an American invention.

The Mandolin is originally from Greece but the F-style that is common in bluegrass was designed and introduced by the Gibson Acoustic music company in the mid 1900's. I believe that Llyod Loar is credited with this design specifically.

The upright bass is the same bass used for centuries in classical music most commonly bowed in those styles.

The resonator guitar was invented again some time in the mid 1900's on standard round neck guitars simply in an attempt to make them louder.

Also the precursor to bluegrass from this country is most commonly known as old time music. It uses basically the same instruments but the style is typically less driving than the Monroe style bluegrass. I'm a Man of Constant Sorrow from the Oh Brother where Art Thou soundtrack would be a good example of this style.

I currently work for a Company that produces bluegrass instruments that oddly enough are named Morgan Monroe (no relation to Bill ) So all of this information is from memory which is why I don't have exact dates (I can't remember )

Happy Trails - do you drive an 18 wheeler SC??

Mikel

SC,

There is a lot of Scottish influence in bluegrass as well. Listen to the fiddles. Having heard a great deal of Scottish fiddling I can hear a great resemblance. We speak on this site of Celtic music in general terms, but as a musician myself, I can hear some differences between Irish and Scottish traditional music. Many people only think of bagpipes when they think of Scottish music, but there is so much more.

A cool style of music, I think, is Scottish dance band. I'm talking with the accordion as the main instrument with fiddles and a kit drummer. Very melodic. You might just hear some familiar rhythms.

Raven, I think I recognize that name. Don't ya'll make mandolins?

I have always heard the title redneck comes from two different sources, the first theory was that the field workers spent the day bent over working the crops and kept red burnt necks. The other theory was that the name is a derogatory term for southerners devooped durring the depression, because of malnutrition and mineral defencies some people devlop a disease (I can't recall the name at this time) that causes the neck to turn red.

Cracker was a title given to the cattle drovers that went to town every year cracking their whip over the cattle head.

Why Yes Randal we do, as well as banjos, guitars, resonators, fiddles and acoustic bass guitars.

I have always heard the title redneck comes from two different sources, the first theory was that the field workers spent the day bent over working the crops and kept red burnt necks. The other theory was that the name is a derogatory term for southerners devooped durring the depression, because of malnutrition and mineral defencies some people devlop a disease (I can't recall the name at this time) that causes the neck to turn red.

Cracker was a title given to the cattle drovers that went to town every year cracking their whip over the cattle head.

I'm only familiar with the first one of those myself....

SC,

There is a lot of Scottish influence in bluegrass as well. Listen to the fiddles. Having heard a great deal of Scottish fiddling I can hear a great resemblance. We speak on this site of Celtic music in general terms, but as a musician myself, I can hear some differences between Irish and Scottish traditional music. Many people only think of bagpipes when they think of Scottish music, but there is so much more.

A cool style of music, I think, is Scottish dance band. I'm talking with the accordion as the main instrument with fiddles and a kit drummer. Very melodic. You might just hear some familiar rhythms.

I know I certainly can tell a difference between these two, Irish and Scottish music are indeed quite different. As for some of the other locales, however; The folk rock is its own, but beyond that I think they emulate the others a bit much to really be destinguished... Personally...

I can tell if someone is following an Irish or Scottish tradition, but I have trouble telling you where they are actually from, be it the isles, The Americas, NZ, or somewhere else...

So glad I stumbled upon this thread, as I was a wee bit close to posting something similar to this in Celtic Music, but decided against it before I checked all over!

I suggest everyone to watch "Songcatcher", an independent film that was created in the past few years starring Aidan Quinn and a truly all-star cast. Anyway, this film tracks the journey of a musicologist into the Southern Appalachian mountains...she stumbles upon the local music, which turns out to be directly descended from Scottish/English ballads. It's not only a terrific film but a wonderful reference to many beautiful ballads including "Lord Randall", "Barbara Allen", "The Two Sisters", and "Mattlry Groves". This was originally suggested to me by Aaediwen and I have to say it was worth the watch!

To beat it all, I went to the library to pick up some written works on these ballads and found two particularly helpful references: the first, 'Folk Songs of the Southern Appalachians' by Jean Ritchie; the second, 'The Ballad Book of John Jacob Niles'. What's very intriguing (to say the least) is that both books reference the same exact ballads but each show differing verions, sometimes within the same book!

Now about the likeness to bluegrass, I have no doubt! While bluegrass is a more modern form, bearing resemblances to and borrowing from these ballads (Ralph Stanley did a rendition of "Conversation with Death" entitled "Oh Death" on the 'Oh Brother, Where Art Thou?' soundtrack; "Conversation with Death was also referenced as one of the ballads in "Songcatcher") I have been delving deeper along the thread of the Scottish/Appalachian ballads connection. Besides, in my opinion, some bluegrass goes a bit too far with some of the artists' attention to a "nasal" sound. I mean, I'm from Eastern Kentucky (deep in the Appalachians in fact) and I don't find bluegrass very appealing just for that aspect alone. Don't get me wrong, I love all kinds of music, but I simply cannot bear to listen to certain artists within the bluegrass genre just for that reason.

Call me crazy...

When I used to sell CDs on my website, we used to get complimentary CDs from the distributor which were relevant to what we generally carried. One of these CDs was "Songcatcher II" and is an often played CD in our household. It was the CD which led us to the movie which we really enjoyed. I looked over the first "Songcatcher" CD but wasn't overly interested in what it offered.

Excerpt from the foreword in the liner notes of "Songcatcher II":

Definately sounds like something to look into. Are the songs the same versions on the second CD as they are in the movie?

I'd heard of the first one and had heard nothing good about it. Your description of the second one sounds promising

The "Songatcher" CDs are put out by Vanguard Records. You can read some of the liner notes and read about the artists on their site.

Songcatcher
Songcatcher II

There are clips of all of the songs from Songcatcher II plus a listing of artists with biographical notes.

Thank you for your help on this Keltic...in fact, I believe I scanned across Songcatcher and Songcatcher II in Barnes and Noble's music section a couple of weeks ago, after Aaediwen raised my interest in the movie. It seemed like Songcatcher II had more authentic songs and artists than the first one did. I know this because I remember looking at the first one and shaking my head.

And to beat it all, I started some research before I had even saw the movie...after I watched the movie, though, my mind was set on finding the versions of those ballads in some CD form. Thank you for your help Keltic!

You're welcome! Just glad that I could help.

Btw, for further reference, I'm going to post a thread on the Celtic Music forum regarding Appalachian/Scottish ballads and the research I have already started. It's gonna be fun and I'd love to get some input from you all once I post the thread...should be up before tomorrow night!

Happy Songhunting!