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Excavation Starts At Stonehenge
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John Clements |
Posted: 09-Apr-2008, 08:25 PM
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QUOTE (UlsterScotNutt @ 09-Apr-2008, 04:55 PM) | QUOTE (John Clements @ 09-Apr-2008, 03:02 PM) | Sorry guys but I still think that a comparison between a grave robber and an archaeologist’s can be made, because you can’t tell me that some archaeologist’s, (even though they keep really good records of their finds, so they can share them with the world), aren’t also looking for fame and fortune. I just can’t totally buy it, because archaeology is a cut throat business, just like grave robbing is. Let me ask you this: Are they not desecrating graves, and turning tombs into tourist spots, and just how much did it cost you the last time you took your kids to a museum? I’d venture to say a lot. Ok, so maybe I’m getting a wee bit jaded in my old age, and they are different, but not by a lot, (at least in my opinion). |
Sorry, JC, can't back you on this one. *** The search for and understanding of our past and the simple act of stealing come from 2 radically different places and mindsets. The overwhelming majority of academia in archaelogy and anthropology are mindful, respectful and understanding on were they tread. I will grant that I do sometimes think that grave exploration and the removal of the body from its original site disturbs me at some level. I am thankful for the Native American Graves Protection and Repatriation Act. Many museums around the world have started to return certain items to their countries of origins. Times and mentalities have changed on how we do things now. There is so much more that is thought through than just taking things for the sake of taking and displaying items publicly. Perhaps , and probable in many cases in the past archaelogy was more of a crash and grab science , but not so today. I have pictures of my grandfather in the Atacama desert of Chile with bones all about him as he dug for items to send back to the States, Chicago Field Museum and the New Hampshire Museum of Natural History. This was in the late teens and 20's of the 1900's. Today he may very well be looked at as nothing better than a graverobber. *** PS , no need to take one for me either buddy!!! |
To quote Gilda…”never mind”…
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UlsterScotNutt |
Posted: 10-Apr-2008, 09:07 AM
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To quote Gilda…”never mind”… No JC, you bring up a good discussion. I just saw a program on these cliff tombs in the Peruvian jungles and how rare it is to find one intact, even in these ridiculously dangerous cliff places> they have been plundered and robbed for centuries. The archaelogist had trouble accessing them even with modern climbing techniques. Part of the big rush and concerns is the graverobbing for profit and invariable these items end up in private collectors hands or are destroyed. Then the site is lessened in its value for study. So do they leave them alone or take them for study and preservation before they are stolen and destroyed or disappear into the netherworld of the rich, obsessed and private collector? Do they become like the graverobber, just at a different level? Or do they study the items onsite and hope for the best and leave them there? A responsibility is inherent in studying the past and nations and peoples today value their history. Should nations return historical property to their origins, like the Elgin Marbles or countless Eygptian artifacts that were removed? They can just as easily be viewed in museums in their native land as in their current location. Is there a distinction for artifacts and human remains? The cultural view that allowed many items to be taken in the past and the culture we view things today has changed tremendously. Do we repatriate everything, somethings, human remains, valuable items, how far back do we go. Many new nations exist today that were part of empires and colonies when the items left home. All legitimate questions that are not black and white. Sorry for rambling.
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Be kind, for everyone you meet is fighting a hard battle. Plato(427-347 BC) Philosopher and Educator
Three things in human life are important: The first is to be kind. The second is to be kind. And the third is to be kind. Henry James (1843-1916) Writer
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stoirmeil |
Posted: 10-Apr-2008, 09:53 AM
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QUOTE (UlsterScotNutt @ 10-Apr-2008, 10:07 AM) | Do we repatriate everything, somethings, human remains, valuable items, how far back do we go. Many new nations exist today that were part of empires and colonies when the items left home. All legitimate questions that are not black and white. Sorry for rambling. |
Oh, no, this isn't rambling -- it's the heart of the question. A lot of definitions shift when "self-evident absolutes" (in their time) like empire and colonialism fade out.
Hey! I know! There's a new Indiana Jones movie coming our really soon. That's real authority on the matter -- if we take the evidence of the typical outcome, good and evil are absolute and immediately recognizable, the good guys are clearly defined by their respect for the indigenous and their vast knowledge of native customs and beliefs, and even the children of the colonized populations know and love them by their purity of intention.
Mmmmm . . . wonder where that leaves our culture experts in Iraq. I'm still hurting over what happened to the country's national museum.
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Camac |
Posted: 10-Apr-2008, 01:46 PM
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During the Heyday of Archaeology, when possession of any treasure of the ancient world was a feather in the cap of the Imperial Powers the ownership of such treasures seemed to be on the basis of "Finders, Keepers" Thankfully we live in somewhat more enlightened times. The modern states that have arisen from the ashes of the old civilization now have enacted laws prohibiting such blatant looting but the question remains do we return that which was taken. Do we dare risk the return of the Ishtar Gate. or thousands of cuniform tablets to Iraq? Does the Berlin Museum dismantle and return the Altar of Pergamum to Turkey? In my opinion no. These great works, though taken under dubious circumstance are at least safe especially from vandalism or destruction by those who would denounce them as works of Satan. At the height of there reign of terror the Taliban destroyed a magnificant statue of Buddha that was carved into a mountain because the Koran forbade Idols.
Camac.
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Garry Denke |
Posted: 17-Apr-2008, 12:43 PM
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QUOTE (ctbard @ 03-Apr-2008, 02:33 PM) | Yes, but none of these articles mention anything about Moses, Aaron, mercy seat, golden arches, breast plates,candelsticks, whatever, where did you get that info?? Your skirting the question. |
The Book says corpses of Moses and Aaron moved by The Ezekiels. Around 50 BC the Sicilian historian Diodorus described the Stone Hedge temple — Hecateus [c 350 BC] and certain others say that in the region beyond the land of the Celts [Gaul] there lies in the ocean an island no smaller than Sicily. This island… is inhabited by the Hyperboreans… there is also on the island a magnificent sacred precinct of Apollo and a notable temple adorned with many votive offerings and spherical in shape — Ezekiel wheels Hyperborea (whirlwind North) temple: Spirit 1 — gold Mercy Seat under Hele Stone Spirit 2 — gold Ark of Testimony under Hele Stone Spirit 3 — gold Table of Manna under Hele Stone Spirit 4 — gold Candlestick under Hele Stone Spirit 5 — gold Girdle under Hele Stone Spirit 6 — gold Breastplate under Hele Stone Spirit 7 — gold Altar of Incense under Hele Stone The brasen Altar of Burnt Offering infolding Seven Spirits Jeremiah the Prophet is Ezekiel the Priest Father Hilkiah and Mother Buzi http://www.britarch.ac.uk/ba/ba74/feat4.shtmlG-D
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Garry Denke |
Posted: 17-Apr-2008, 12:58 PM
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QUOTE (UlsterScotNutt @ 02-Apr-2008, 10:34 AM) | GD has put in some time and effort in creating his stonehedge world, thats for sure!!! Very creative!!!!!! |
Paleolithic 800,000-year-old Acheulian hand-axes from Homo erectus opencast Pembrokeshire Coalfield anthracite Coal cinders and South Wales Coalfield bituminous Bottom ashes indicate pre-Neanderthal coal mining. Homo erectus burnt 800,000-year-old Crosskeys Coal fly-ashes sampled from Pontycymer Class C - Class F bituminous South Wales Coalfield mined Paleolithic cave dates 700,000 years previous to 100,000 years. The German historian, antiquarian, and dentist, Doctor Garry Whilhelm Denke (1622-1699), recovered the 800,000-year-old Acheulian hand-axes and sampled the 800,000-year-old Crosskeys Coal fly-ashes in 1656. Neanderthal following the West-East anthracite Pembrokeshire Coalfield - bituminous South Wales Coalfield trend to their opencast Bristol Coalfield discovery caused Homo sapien Mesolithic dug 3 Coal dusters. http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/20...ns_britain.htmlhttp://www.durhamrecordsonline.com/literat...lds-british.gifhttp://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/science/nature/5317762.stmRest simple History, under the Heelstone.
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Garry Denke |
Posted: 17-Apr-2008, 01:04 PM
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QUOTE (oldraven @ 09-Apr-2008, 09:26 AM) | I have to disagree there. The goals of a grave robber are very different than those of an Anthropologist or Archaeologist. One is driven by greed, the other by the desire to understand our origins and share those discoveries with the world. |
Stonehenge Coal Trend http://www.durhamrecordsonline.com/literat...lds-british.gifhttp://www.bbc.co.uk/dna/mbhistory/F223381...?thread=5273545http://www.thisisdorset.net/display.var.21...2199212.0.0.phpDenke is saying that Britain's oldest 3 coal fields surface 40 miles apart, from west to east; Pembrokeshire, South Wales, then Bristol. The first 2 were discovered by Homo erectus 800kya, the third by Neanderthal 100kya, Denke's hand-axes, coal cinders and fly-ashes dated. Later, after the extinction of Homo erectus and Neanderthal, Homo sapiens explored Salisbury Plain for coal, first 10kya (carpark tests), then 5kya (henge ditches). Denke is saying these 3 oldest coal fields of Britain being aligned 40 miles apart is what caused Salisbury Plain coal exploration. Why? Because that area is 40 miles southeast of Bristol in the alignment. That equal distance and direction resulted in Woodhenge, Durrington Walls, Stonehenge, Avebury henges, etc. being dug 5kya by Homo sapiens on Salisbury Plain. None of them had any coal of course, and according to Denke they discovered certain coal bearing "white stone" (limestone vs. chalk) differences, carbonate fossils, as the cause. Because the other henge sites were being lived on by Homo sapiens, unoccupied Stonehenge was chosen for the school, with athletics. Later, 'education' rocks from around Britain's first 2 coal fields, Pembrokeshire and South Wales, were brought for Geology class exhibits. Teachers and parents honored Welsh coal miners on Saturdays, student football was on Sundays. Personally, my thought on this is that Denke is insane, because schools never have athletics. http://www.online-archaeology.co.uk/forum/...p?TOPIC_ID=2537http://www.bbc.co.uk/dna/mbhistory/F223381...?thread=5312359http://www.thenakedscientists.com/forum/in...php?topic=13284Garry Denke
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Garry Denke |
Posted: 17-Apr-2008, 01:11 PM
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QUOTE (A Shrule Egan @ 05-Apr-2008, 07:39 PM) | He's been spreading this crap and other subjects for many years, all over the internet, with the same results on those forums. People question where he came up with such information and he refuses to give answers. Just adds more garbage as a reply.
He also owns an oil and gas exploration company in Texas that actually is registered and files a K-10 form each year. Funny thing was, I could never find that the company really has ever discovered anything. Sounds like it's just a paper company to rub his ego.
Simplist thing to do, is ignore anything he ever posts from now on, or better yet, maybe Mac will just can him for nonsense posting. |
Now that Timothy Darvill, Archaeologist and Geoffrey Wainwright, Archaeologist have confirmed Stonehenge broadly mirrors South Wales geology as proposed by Garry Denke, Geologist in the '70s, here are more geological, paleontological, and geophysical papers from their reading list. 1) Denke, G.W. 1973. Stonehenge Phase I: An Openpit Coalfield Model; The First Geologic Mining School. (Indiana University of Pennsylvania) GDG, 73: 1-56. 2) Denke, G.W. 1975. Invertibrate Paleontology of the High Tor Limestone (Lower Carboniferous) and the Upper Senonian Chalk (Late Cretaceous) of Stonehenge. (Arizona State University) GDG, 75: 1-7. 3) Denke, G.W. 1977. Possible Source Areas of the High Tor Limestone (Early Mississippian) Fill of the Aubrey Holes and Heel Stone Ditch in Europe. (Arizona State University) GDG, 77: 1-24. 4) Beus, S.S. 1984. Fossil Associations in the High Tor Limestone (Lower Carboniferous) of South Wales. (Northern Arizona University) Journal of Paleontology, 58: 3; 651-667. 5) Denke, G.W. 1984. Mid-Dinantian (Waulsortian Facies) High Tor Limestone: The First Stones Transported to Stonehenge from the South Wales Coast. (Arizona State University) GDG, 84: 1-4. 6) Denke, G. 1984. Magnetic and Electromagnetic Surveys at Heelstone, Stonehenge, United Kingdom. (Indiana University of Pennsylvania) GDG, 84: 5-42. 7) Lees, A. and Miller, J. 1985. Facies variatian in Waulsortian buildups, Part 2; Mid-Dinantian buildups from Europe and North America. (Revised) Geological Journal, 20: 159-180. 8) Geologist, Denke, G. 1986. The Paleontology of Stonehenge, England. (Arizona State University) GDG, 86: 1-3. (State of Texas, County of Stonewall, Book 393, Pages 848-853) http://www.archaeology.co.uk/index.php?opt...d=402&Itemid=26Archaeology is a fascinating subject. Enjoy.
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Garry Denke |
Posted: 24-Apr-2008, 02:49 AM
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H E A T
Wiltshire Mystery Ruined
Salisbury Plain overlies a very large Coalfield, unfortunately too deep to mine economically.
dusters in white -> http://www.coalpro.co.uk/images/coalmap.jpg
Pembrokeshire Coalfield -> South Wales Coalfield -> Bristol Coalfield -> Avebury duster Pembrokeshire Coalfield -> South Wales Coalfield -> Bristol Coalfield -> Cursus duster Pembrokeshire Coalfield -> South Wales Coalfield -> Bristol Coalfield -> Durrington Walls duster Pembrokeshire Coalfield -> South Wales Coalfield -> Bristol Coalfield -> Long Barrow duster Pembrokeshire Coalfield -> South Wales Coalfield -> Bristol Coalfield -> Robin Hood's Ball duster Pembrokeshire Coalfield -> South Wales Coalfield -> Bristol Coalfield -> Stonehenge duster Pembrokeshire Coalfield -> South Wales Coalfield -> Bristol Coalfield -> Woodhenge duster
http://www.coalpro.co.uk/images/coalmap.jpg dusters in white ->
Dr. Garry Denke (1622-1699) Hidden Energy Amalgamate Theory The Coal Stones and The Healing Stones
Stonehenge Mining College The First Borean University
a) Irish Sea Glacier dumps black Volcanic Bluestone rock erratics at Seven Sisters in centre of South Wales Coalfield faulted Oval of Horseshoes. b) Black Ordovician Bluestone rock mysteriously does not produce fire like plentiful ordinary black Carboniferous Coal rock at circling rim of fires. c) Homo sapiens begin worshipping rare black Volcanic Bluestone rock power over fire at the South Wales Coalfield faulted Horseshoes Oval. d) Preseli Hills springs of black Ordovician Bluestone rock that create water found being the internal reason for mysterious power over fire. e) Superstitions springing up from powerful black Volcanic Bluestone rock that sooths Coalfire burn wounds with water it creates fuel myths. f) Cold lower-class Homo sapiens having to stoke wood fires throughout night desire Hot upper-class Homo sapiens living style of sleeping all night. g) Pembrokeshire Coalfield -> South Wales Coalfield -> Bristol Coalfield -> Salisbury Plain Coal Prospect generated by cold lower-class geologists. h) Elders attribute multiple failures at Salisbury Plain Coal Prospect to absence of The Healing Stones' power at the centre of duster digging area. i) Pigskin leather football (rugby) and lambskin leather volleyball (soccer) geology student falls on field seeing "white stone" younger creatures. j) Upper-class Homo sapiens agree to lend The Healing Stones in their Horseshoes brought by the Irish to lower-class Homo sapiens neighbors. k) Parents' students bring tons of "white stone" from South Wales Coalfield Oval to palaeontology department with deflated pigskins and lambskins. l) 19-18-19 recalcitrant elders 'space'-out '56 basinward Carboniferous Coal rim cave chimneys - cave vents for "white smoke stone" comparison. m) Field rim '56 cave chimneys filled and excess "white stone" piled toward first 3 pine marked dusters styling Pembrokeshire Coalfield outcrop. n) Structural geology of South Wales Coalfield conveyed in each Q and R hole pair separated by thrust trench in the Double Horseshoe model. o) Green sparkling Cosheston watered Irish delivered Old Red erratic Seven Sisters' beacons rock entrance keeping the way of the 3 of pine. p) Heal stone problem, water problem, burn problem, class problem, etc with The Healing Stones' delivery to Coal Prospect duster area made. q) With newest version of 'net' available College volleyball grows in popularity and "Laws of the Game" for football and rugby are now changed. r) Elders attribute continuing Salisbury Plain Coal Prospect failures to centre disconnection with Stonehenge Bottom spring at northeast valley. s) Q and R holes thrust The Healing Stones having no power of creating Coal or water and remaining '56 chimney "white stone" packed at thrust. t) Lower-class Homo sapiens' black Volcanic Bluestone rock loan agreement honoured and return made to Seven Sisters as deeper shoring fails. u) Geologists locate 'higher education' rock nearby and recalcitrant '56 convince orthodox elders 'capping graduates' in pairs makes for success. v) College teaches upper-class Homo sapiens' minimalist logo architecture at its sophisticated best and The Healing Stones a gift back donation. w) Ezekiels whirl Borean wind Wheels north for Pagans, Druids, and Wiccans tunnel Deals shoeing The Healing Stones' Seven Sisters' Spirits. x) Tunnel Engineer I. Kingdom Brunel (1806-1859) and Mining Engineer William Gowland (1842-1922) ancestors College the 3 shoring of tunnels. y) Pagans, Druids, and Wiccans build 30 Y holes fence for 'roped-out' tourists caught climbing rim perimeter bracing and inside mine shoring. z) Borean University entrance at gap 29 Z holes fence for 'roped-in' tourists observing Stonehenge Mining College in action on the Ancient path.
http://www.geolsoc.org.uk/webdav/site/GSL/...SWcoalfield.JPG
Palynology is geology, flowers flourish Twice.
Carboniferous Whitestone
The Healing Stones' Q and R holes are features of similar shape and identical filling, each pair connected by a trench, resulting in a 'dumb-bell' shaped feature. After removal of Volcanic Bluestone from Q and R holes, the center part of each 'dumb-bell' was filled with very tightly packed clean Carboniferous Whitestone chalky rubble, the remaining primary fill of the original 'dumb-bell' from '56 holes (Hawley Holes / Aubrey Holes). The expanded Q and R holes' ends of each 'dumb-bell' shaped feature were then backfilled with dirtier Cretaceous White Chalk from '01 ditch (Altar Stone Ditch / Heel Stone Ditch). The Healing Stones' clean Carboniferous Whitestone filled Q and R holes' trench was auger cored in '56 by Doctor Dentist Garry Denke (1622-1699) as confirmed in '01 by Mining Engineer William Gowland (1842-1922) around mine Stone '56.
The Ancient was Right ! Coal IS under that hill !
H E A T
Garry Denke
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Garry Denke |
Posted: 26-Apr-2008, 04:44 PM
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Yep, and at Today's Coal Posted Price; the Ancient Prospect now economical.
We're going to dig it! --------------------
Stonehenge Building Materials:
For those unfamiliar with the 5 basic rock types at Stonehenge; here is a list of them in chronological order of their first arrival.
85 MYA
White Chalk - The outcrop sedimentary rock of Stonehenge is Late Cretaceous Period, Santonian Age, calcium carbonate. Late Cretaceous Period outcrop sedimentary rock is the in situ construction material used by the Stonehenge builders. This material is approximately 85 million years old. This stone is called Seaford Chalk Formation rock. White in color, this building material is from Stonehenge Ditch mining area.
3100 BC
Whitestone - The oldest limestone sedimentary rock of Stonehenge is Early Carboniferous (Mississippian) Period, Arundian Age, calcium carbonate. Early Carboniferous Period limestone sedimentary rock is the first (1st) construction material imported by the Stonehenge builders. This material is approximately 340 million years old. This stone is called High Tor (Birnbeck) Limestone Formation rock. White in color, this building material is from South Wales Coalfield mining area.
3000 BC
Cosheston - The oldest sandstone sedimentary rock of Stonehenge is Devonian Period micaceous silicate. Devonian Period sandstone sedimentary rock is the second (2nd) construction material imported by the Stonehenge builders. This material is approximately 408 million years old. This stone is called Senni Beds (Old Red Sandstone) Formation rock. Green in color, this building material is from South Wales Coalfield mining area.
2600 BC
Bluestone - The volcanic rock (oldest geologically) of Stonehenge is Ordovician Period intrusive igneous diabase (dolerite) and extrusive igneous felsite (rhyolite) and tuff (basic). Ordovician Period igneous rock is the third (3rd) construction material imported by the Stonehenge builders. This material is approximately 470 million years old. This stone is called Ordovician Volcanic rock. Black in color, this building material is from South Wales Coalfield mining area.
2200 BC
Sarsen - The youngest sandstone sedimentary rock of Stonehenge is Oligocene-Miocene (Tertiary) Period silicate. Oligocene-Miocene Period sandstone sedimentary rock is the fourth (4th) construction material imported by the Stonehenge builders. This material is approximately 24 million years old. This stone is called Reading Formation rock. Gray in color, this building material is from Marlborough Downs mining area.
Note that this order is consistent with both rock transport theories; rock transported by a glacier and rock transported by the Ancient.
Both! One twice! Hope this helps!
http://www.open2.net/forum/showthread.php?p=22421 http://www.bbc.co.uk/dna/mbhistory/F223381...?thread=5312359
The Ancient!
Garry W. Denke Geologist/Geophysicist Denke Oil Company (DOC) Wildcat Station, P.O. Box 866488 Plano, Texas 75086-6488
[email protected] http://www.garrydenke.com [email protected] http://www.denocoinc.com
Tel: 972-422-8268 Fax: 972-422-7868 Cell: 972-768-4631 DOC: 570-788-5282
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Garry Denke |
Posted: 26-Apr-2008, 04:48 PM
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STONEHENGE: Replica of Mine
Seventy Seven Stonehenge Sarsens Shoring Seven Sisters Support
Seventy Seven Stonehenge Sarsens Shoring Seven Sisters Support
"Old Red after White, then Black, and Pale" ~King Arthur
Crop and Circle
The First Stone of Stonehenge is "white stone", Cretaceous and Carboniferous. Dr Garry Denke (1622-1699) found them, while coring at Stonehenge, in 1656. They are the key to understanding Salisbury Plain's past, both Mesolithic and Neolithic archaeology. The First Stone of Stonehenge is very important, both of them germane, Dr Garry Denke's.
Garry Denke's public papers are in Official Public (Deed) Records, note the word "public". Recorded over a decade(s) ago, for the Public, and free for kids. Not like Journal of Paleontology, Geological Journal, et al, that charge kids. Garry Denke's public papers filed on FidoNet also, over a decade(s) ago. Thanks to Tom Jennings, FTP, Usenet, BBS, etc.
Flora and Fauna
Altar Stone was in Stonehole 96 Heelstone was in Stonehole 97 (left Stone below Heelstone)
Bow Wow Fido
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