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| Celtic Radio Community > Philosophy & Science > Religious Vs. Spirituality |
| Posted by: jpmoore 11-Jan-2005, 11:27 AM |
| I have heard a number of times someone state that they are not "religious, but are spiritual". What does this mean? My initial thought is that when a person states that they are spiritual, as opposed to being religious, they are merely excusing themslves from the fellowship of believers. Meaning, it is an excuse for not going to church. I realized this may not be true at all. It is just an initial theory of mine on the subject. Our salvation is not based upon church attendance, but it is something our Lord asks us to do (Hebrews 10:25).  Any thoughts? |
| Posted by: maisky 11-Jan-2005, 11:56 AM | ||
There are many different religeous doctrins in the world. Some people believe in one doctrine and get their "spirituality" from that. Some chose to study more than one tradition and develop their spiritual nature in THAT fashion. We should never make the mistake of thinking that OUR way is the ONLY way.  The fact that you are asking this question is a very good indication that you have a strong seeking spirit.  |
| Posted by: Shadows 11-Jan-2005, 12:51 PM |
| Religion is the following of a man induced system of belief... Spirituality is a connection with the energy that is all around in the universe for all to share. Yes it is that simple. |
| Posted by: maisky 11-Jan-2005, 01:07 PM | ||
Good answer, Sir Shadows! Sometimes a simple answer cuts to the truth. |
| Posted by: maryellen 11-Jan-2005, 05:39 PM |
| When I looked up Hebrews 10:25, here is the NIV version: "Let us not give up meeting together, as some are in the habit of doing, but let us encourage one another?and all the more as you see the Day approaching." Could it be an excuse not to go to church? Quite possibly. Many people think they are doing okay and following the Christian way, when sometimes they are not. And they don't want others telling them that. Also, Jesus said at the Last Supper "Do this in remembrance of me." That communion is commanded by Jesus for us to do. Religion I see more as something studied, a classification for us to use. Spirituality as your relationship with God. external versus internal. |
| Posted by: White Goddess 11-Jan-2005, 10:16 PM |
| I myself find that I am both religious and spiritual but I do not go to church. I practice the wiccan religion and I have found that there are wiccan churches for people who practice in a coven but I choose to practice solitary. So just because someone may be religious doesn't mean that they have to go to church. |
| Posted by: CelticRose 17-Jan-2005, 03:52 PM |
| In Christianity, we are taught that religion is man/woman trying to seek and please God through their works. Spirituality, on the other hand, is God seeking relationship with His creation and, thus, us having fellowship with the Creator. God is not seeking our works, He is seeking our heart and we are saved by His grace. Once again, this is the Christian point of view so as to not offend others. |
| Posted by: Shadows 17-Jan-2005, 04:13 PM |
| Not offended! One can be Spiritual without being Religious.... As I stated before religion(s) is/are the creation of mankind... Spiritualism is the recognition of the forces ( the Creator ) all around us. One can be religious without having one ounce of spirituality in their body or soul... the folks that followed Jim Jones were religious, but had no idea about Spirituality... that is why they are gone.... Yes Jim Jones called himself christian, as well as many others that have been called cults... def: cults : the following of beliefs not common to the norm... christians were once called a cult. |
| Posted by: CelticRose 17-Jan-2005, 04:22 PM |
| yes! I would agree with you, Shadows, on everything you said! |
| Posted by: Shadows 17-Jan-2005, 06:08 PM |
| I do not try to admonish one belief or another... I just want all to look with eyes wide open and see what is truely there...and follow their hearts and spirit to what is right for them and all mankind... Believe with your heart, praise that which made you and do not fall victim to the teachings of man... look to the creator and all around you for the answers... What ever you believe is not wrong! |
| Posted by: maisky 18-Jan-2005, 06:40 AM | ||
Sir Shadows, thanks for pointing out the "limited" nature of that definition of cult. Too many folks consider that to be it's true definition and use it to justify religious biggotry. Your message of tolerance is RIGHT ON THE MARK. There is room for many belief systems in the world. Tolerance is a VERY good idea. |
| Posted by: maryellen 18-Jan-2005, 05:34 PM |
| "Once again, this is the Christian point of view so as to not offend others. " Why must we apologize for having a Christain view in a Christian forum (Kirk and Chapel)??! I find this very disturbing. (I am not blaming you CelticRose at all. I think it has more to do with the audience.) |
| Posted by: Aaediwen 18-Jan-2005, 08:57 PM | ||
Agreed One should never have to appologise for their beliefs, even if they *DO* offend IMHO.Everyone has a right to their opinion. Voice it proudly! I just double checked, and Maryellen is in error on what forum she is in, but what she says still applies here. We are all of varying faiths here, Christian, Wiccan, Shaman, Druid, I don't doubt Buddhist, Muslum, etc... And in the end we are all human. One of the nice things about this world in which we live, and a nice thing about the Internet is that people of all different races, nationalities, religons and creed can come together and share without shame. No need for appologies I know I certainly am not offended. Keep telling us what you think everyone  /me gives CelticRose a nice comfy seat to stay in the conversation There are warnings of entering this forum at your own risk on this perticular forum for those who might be asilly offended. I'd say don't worry about offending those here |
| Posted by: Shadows 18-Jan-2005, 09:19 PM |
| Thanks Aae I was going to point that out to maryellen, but I decided to leave it be and let someone else say something or for her to realize her mistake. Tolerance is needed world wide for all beliefs and practices!!!!! Persicusion and intolerance have no place in this world today. |
| Posted by: jpmoore 19-Jan-2005, 11:22 AM | ||
I like your answer CelticRose! So many times we try to be religious and completely forget the spiritual side. |
| Posted by: CelticRose 19-Jan-2005, 01:36 PM | ||
Well I didn't feel like I was apologizing. I was just stating that this was from a Christian point of view because this topic started in the Kirk and Chapel and ended up here. So since others were expressing their points of view, I was stating mine and saying it was from a Christian perspective because I mostly wanted to answer JPMoore directly to whom is a Christian, if I am not mistaken and doing so without offending others. I do not like to push my beliefs on anyone, but at the same time I confess as a Christian I find myself feeling like I always have to be careful when I do express my opinion as non-Christians always seem to think I am trying to push my beliefs on them when I think we are just having a conversation. I am open to hearing everyone's point of view, but in my experiences, no one seems to care if the Christian gets offended or not.  |
| Posted by: dragonboy3611 20-Jan-2005, 07:34 PM |
| I believe there is no difference in Religious Vs. Spirituality, that is exactly what Religion is! I mean, what else is religion if it is not a spiritual thing? |
| Posted by: jpmoore 21-Jan-2005, 11:58 AM | ||
From what I am thinking and reading here, I would say yes...and no. I see religion (having it or being it) as more of an outward action. Religion is going to church, mosque or synagogue, etc. Religion is action. But that action may not have sincere motives. Religion can be good, but many times it is used for bad. Spirituality is internal: in the heart, in the the soul. I ramble.. forgive me... |
| Posted by: dragonboy3611 21-Jan-2005, 12:15 PM |
| Well than I have to put in my other opinion. You can be an avid christian in my eyes, without ever attending church. Church is just a material thing, god, is no were near material. To believe in god, you just need the spiritual aspect of your religion. So in turn, I believe that's the only thing religion is. Attending mass, helping others, true, the religious part of it, but not really truley needed to be devoted to god. |
| Posted by: maisky 24-Jan-2005, 07:02 AM |
| I am glad we can agree to disagree here, without worrying about offending our friends. Religion and Spirituality are intensly personal for most people. There is room for ALL belief systems. If anybody has a real NEED to be offended though, they can go to the politics forum for their fix of abuse.  |
| Posted by: oldraven 09-Feb-2005, 12:08 PM |
Religion is the Hymn. Spirituality is the passion with which you sing it.  I am a very spiritual person, and am somewhat religious. I have my faith. Faith is where Spiritualiy really lies. Religion is simply the doctrine that people attach to their faith. And for some, religion is simply what was taught to them, and have no spirituality at all. Feeling the bread on your tongue is religion (comunion). Standing in the heart of the forest and feeling you're not alone is Spirituality. I'm not sure how much of that made sense to anyone else. |
| Posted by: deckers 09-Feb-2005, 12:21 PM | ||
There is absolutely a big difference. Religion is the outward following of established practices and traditions. Spirituality is the inward relationship with the higher being of your choice. Just because a person goes to church does not make them a Christian anymore than sitting in my garage makes you a car. You said as much in your follow up message: Religion = attending church = a material thing. Spirituality = devotion to God = a mental thing. THAT is the difference. Erik |
| Posted by: oldraven 09-Feb-2005, 12:25 PM |
| Just because a person goes to church does not make them a Christian anymore than sitting in my garage makes you a car. I'm going to have to remember that one. |
| Posted by: Siobhan Blues 01-Mar-2005, 12:51 PM | ||
Makes sense to me! Spirituality is so deep, so personal, its different with everyone - I believe each of us has a unique connection/relationship to the creator God. We express ourselves to Him differently, and we have different needs - but there are central core truths as to Gods identity that apply to all of us and are the key to a closer relationship with God. I think of denominations as a style of worship rather than the thing in which God can be found. SB |
| Posted by: Celtic cat 29-Mar-2005, 07:47 PM |
| I have to agree with most everyone, especially on the differences between the two. One thing though.... without the religion aspect of sprirtuality most people won't grow any closer to God( or Creator). If I could meet one person that does not go to church and still reads the Bible <enough to learn what God intended us to know>, and prays <and really means it>, then I promise I will never mention this again. Monty Python skit: "Oh Reginald, I dissagree." |
| Posted by: Celtic cat 29-Mar-2005, 07:52 PM |
| I quickly must edit my post as I meant to say. "reads the bible and learns what God intended for us" and also "prays and means it" I apologize for the miss print |
| Posted by: WizardofOwls 29-Mar-2005, 07:57 PM |
| Hello there Celtic Cat! Guess what! You've just met one! My church is having serious problems due to a serious split in the congregation. My wife and I disagree with some things that are happening in our church. We have decided not to go back until the smoke settles. That has been over a year ago. I still read my Bible everyday, as soon as I get out of bed in the morning and before going to sleep each night. I pray daily as well, along with my daily Bible readings and off and on throughout the day. I love God with all of my heart and would never let the problems we are ahving with our church keepme from continuing with my daily devotionals. I am not saying that people should do without church as a matter of course. We would not be doing without now if given a choice, but we don't want to go to anohter - that is our home church and family after all - but we are not comfortable in ours just now with the way things are. I feel that church is a vital part of the Christian experience, but it is possible to survive without it if necessary, jsut much more difficult. Remember there are Christians throughout the world who live in places where Christianity is forbidden and have no choice to practice their religion without a church. It IS dificult but it can and in some situations MUST be done. Just my two cents worth... May God richly bless each and every one of you! |
| Posted by: Shadows 29-Mar-2005, 09:16 PM |
| To quote something I heard recently: "...religions divide people, spirituality brings them back together..." |
| Posted by: Celtic cat 30-Mar-2005, 05:55 PM |
| Okay WizardofOwls, a promise I shall keep. |
| Posted by: j Padraig moore 01-Apr-2005, 01:03 PM | ||
Interesting quote...and a very true one indeed. Thanks Shadows. |
| Posted by: oldraven 01-Apr-2005, 02:15 PM | ||
As evidenced by WizardofOwls' home church. |
| Posted by: j Padraig moore 01-Apr-2005, 02:39 PM |
| Concerning Wizardofowls situation, I went through a similar thing back in the 1980s. It basically came down to the folks who were long time members of the church, showing us young whippersnappers the door. Of course it did not happen that way. It is way too long of a story for that explanation. But essentially, I have experienced the breakdown in communication and trust that one expects within a community, such as your local congregation. Its tough, and heartbreaking. We pray all works out for the best Wiz. |
| Posted by: CelticRose 01-Apr-2005, 05:43 PM |
| I have personally been through a church split twice. It was the most painful and disappointing thing I had ever been through. Sadly, I still haven't gotten over it and have a hard time fully trusting people in the church. I go, but I try not to get involved like I used to. I have several friends from my current church who are constantly asking me when are me and my hubby actually joining the church (we have been attending there 5 years) and I am still very hesitant to do so. I am also always asked to join someone's home Bible study, but I never do anymore and prefer to study on my own. |
| Posted by: Siobhan Blues 07-Apr-2005, 04:17 PM |
| A long time ago, our church had a group of people within its membership that became dissatisfied with our pastor at the time... they became very active at trying to stir up dissent within the congregation and succeeded in turning some people against the pastor. What followed was the most unpleasant, disappointing thing I have ever witnessed in a church. So many people turned against the pastor that he felt he was no longer able to steer the church towards any long-term goals, and he resigned... there was such a large number of folks who supported him that the resignation was actually refused in a business meeting, and we all hoped that things would settle down. They did not, and a few weeks later he resigned for good and left. About a fourth of the membership left too. As much as all that hurt our church, and as many sour feelings were left in the wake of the departure, we eventually found another pastor with a different style of preaching and leading that put us on another path to the future. It is incredibly disappointing to see people do such horrendous things when they don't like a pastor or there is some other issue at stake... I've continued to attend this same church and altho my faith in my fellow church members has been damaged I still go there and find a lot of benefits in the current pastor's teachings and the other activities that are going on now. SB |