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> The World Of Academia, Driving me crazy!
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SCShamrock 
Posted: 14-Sep-2005, 12:57 PM
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QUOTE (MacEoghainn @ 14-Sep-2005, 12:00 PM)
You can call me an old stick in mud if you'd like but this thread appears to belong in the Philosophy, Science & Religion forum.

Just my two cents,

MacE

Maybe, but I'll bet it makes its way to a religious discussion before too long. smile.gif


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reddrake79 
Posted: 14-Sep-2005, 11:30 PM
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Can you have science without religion (or personal beliefs)?


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Dugadelphia 
Posted: 14-Sep-2005, 11:57 PM
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Without religion, yes.

Without personal belief or some degree of preconceived notions or bias, no.


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stoirmeil 
Posted: 15-Sep-2005, 09:47 AM
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QUOTE (Dugadelphia @ 14-Sep-2005, 11:57 PM)
Without religion, yes.

Without personal belief or some degree of preconceived notions or bias, no.

True. I also think that even without a specific dogma, a scientist that is dedicated to his or her work is very likely to be moved by the phenomena being studied, and not just remain matter of fact about it. There's a baseline enthusiasm that turns into something like awe when it's confronted with the beauty, or the intricacy, or the elegance of whatever it is.
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CelticCoalition 
Posted: 15-Sep-2005, 10:17 AM
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Platypi are so funny.


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Siobhan Blues 
Posted: 16-Sep-2005, 02:42 PM
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QUOTE (MDF3530 @ 13-Sep-2005, 04:36 PM)
Some species of monkeys still have tails. What holds that in place? A tailbone. Humans have tailbones too, which is clear evidence that, at one point during the formation of the human body, it had a tail.

LOVE the picture!!! That makes me think God has a good sense of humor, like looking at a hippo does.

But as far as the evolution theory goes, I don't think the fact that humans have a backbone means that they ever had a tail. It just means that they just have backbones.



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stoirmeil 
Posted: 18-Sep-2005, 04:49 PM
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There is a vestigial tailbone in humans (coccyx) that has no practical function, except to get bruised and very painful and slow to heal when humans have sit-down accidents like slipping on ice and landing on their butts. Also, human fetal development follows the overall pattern of evolution, and embryos and early fetuses certainly do have tails. smile.gif

This need to split the issue into "either-or" really mystifies me. Is it impossible to postulate that God used evolution as a tool?

Is it that God isn't getting equal time in the educational system that is the issue?

Or is there a desire to separate the human species from all the rest of nature, so some superior (and therefore privileged) position and prerogatives can be inferred?

It's kind of sweet that you make the jump from YOU finding hippos and platypi funny-looking, to GOD has a sense of humor for making them that way. The hippos and the platypi, however, probably don't see it that way at all, and why should they?smile.gif
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Antwn 
Posted: 27-Sep-2005, 03:30 PM
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I've had similar questions Stoirmeil. Why isn't evolution the methodology of an intellegent designer? Why is creation thought of as finished not ongoing? Why isn't it thought of aesthetically, as a work of art so adroit that aspects of the creation also create, perhaps perpetually.

To me, its sad that intellegent design as a theory is so often hijacked as a surreptitious attempt to justify Christian dogma via science, and that there's a dearth of a more creative approach to possibilities which don't conform to Christian assumptions. Christian concepts seem to follow intellegent design everywhere like loyal pooch to master begging for biscuits of vindication.

Acknowledgement of a creator implies no specific intent except to create and facilitate continuity of an orderly functionality thereof. While amorality for example has affected the microchasm (human society), its effect hasn't circumvented the cosmic order, though I guess that would depend on your definition. I just have trouble gazing at the universe and imagining a teleological argument that includes a cosmic overseer fixated upon micromanaging the morality of mankind and enacting "His" judgements within a reward/punishment paradigm. Its a kindergarden idea bereft of beauty or intelligence, IMO, whereas the universe itself is not (understatement du jour).

The persistence of human tendency to parse viewpoints into opposite extremes, as if only those possibilities were worthy of consideration, is probably one of the most dysfunctional bits of pseudo-comprehension imaginable, not to mention frustrating to interact with. Considering the lack of utility of such encapulations (assuming a true and comprehensive understanding is sincerely desired to begin with), one wonders why such habits are held so tenaciously. Enlighten me Stoirmeilanandaji!

By the way, wasn't this thread about the pains of Academia? Come now, evolution vs. creationism can't be the ONLY arthritic restraint to intellectual mobility in that august body!



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Celtic cat 
Posted: 14-Nov-2005, 05:07 PM
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QUOTE (SCShamrock @ 28-Jul-2005, 09:09 AM)
What's driving me nuts is the two classes I am taking right now: Religions of the world, and environmental science.

Just think of the classes in a way that you think of the stories more than the religious aspects. For instance, Mecca. This is a great story. Even if you don't believe in why it happened it still happened and it is history. Don't take the religions class as anything other than a history course. Think of it as understanding other cultures, and how can one see something wrong with that. What is really funny is that as a Christian you may still dissagree with what your book says about Christianity. As far as science goes, well I understand look at it with an open mind. Try not to look at it too indepth just memorize what the book/notes say and take the test.


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SCShamrock 
Posted: 15-Nov-2005, 08:37 AM
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QUOTE (Celtic cat @ 14-Nov-2005, 05:07 PM)
Just think of the classes in a way that you think of the stories more than the religious aspects. For instance, Mecca. This is a great story. Even if you don't believe in why it happened it still happened and it is history. Don't take the religions class as anything other than a history course. Think of it as understanding other cultures, and how can one see something wrong with that. What is really funny is that as a Christian you may still dissagree with what your book says about Christianity. As far as science goes, well I understand look at it with an open mind. Try not to look at it too indepth just memorize what the book/notes say and take the test.

Thanks Cat for the advice. Actually, I finished those classes and have since taken and finished two others.

So I'll give a little update. Currently, I have 30 credits earned since December 24 of last year. I received my first -A this last set of classes, and am now sitting at a 3.97 GPA. Now I am taking a break, the first since starting 10 months ago. I'll take a month off, and then get back to it and finish in another 10 months.
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Celtic cat 
Posted: 15-Nov-2005, 04:46 PM
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Opps sorry about the lateness then, but grats on finishing your "semester" well.
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Druid_of_Ark 
Posted: 11-Dec-2007, 10:57 PM
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On the possibility of Evolution I have but 2 things to say. Firstly, man is not superior to the apes, they do not rob eachother nor steal eachothers mates. Second no ape would ever stoop so low as to try and rig an election to become the leader as George Bush did, thus Apes are superior, and yet that may prove Evolution for if you pile a load of wood and pipes and wires it does not evolve into a building it rots so in fact Evolution may be going from a superior form to an inferior!


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