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Celtic Radio Community > Gaelic Languages > Persian/celtic Links

Posted by: susieq76 28-Jan-2005, 09:58 AM

In doing reading on various Celtic languages, and culture it has been very interesting to see what I found to be a connection between these languages and those in the Middle East. I thought at first that I might perhaps be crazy (well, I am, but provably so), and then yesterday when reading up on Welsh language sites I came across several sources saying there was a link between these languages - more so than any European languages. It was very interesting to me, and I thought it would be great to explore those ties here. Especially since we have our very own expert in house: phoenix07!! So, is anyone else interested in exploring this, or am I the only one?

I would love to hear your thoughts on this!

Posted by: phoenix07 28-Jan-2005, 05:42 PM

im blushed now :S
i believe that there are connections between all languages of the world, if we knew them all !
i find lot of similarities between english & persian, but considering that old persian was way different than the one sopken now..
i just saw a show on persian tv talkin bout how different & similar are the languages of persia, interesting topic

i cant help with similarities between gaelic & persian languages since i speak no gaelic

but i can help out with english

for example we call mother : "madar - pronounced modar"
eyebrow: "abroo"

my brain is blank now! i cant think of any thing more than that

but if any one wants to know more or would like to learn at least the basics of persian language/culture id be more than happy

Posted by: WizardofOwls 28-Jan-2005, 05:56 PM

Hi! This really sounds like a very interesting topic! I don't have much that I can add, though, since I know nothing about Persian. I will be reading and adding when I feel I have something to say that might help. The Scottish Gaelic for mother is māthair, similar to both the Persian and English. The Gaelic for eyebrow, however, is mala, which is not similar to either!

Posted by: susieq76 31-Jan-2005, 09:09 AM

Here is what I found on Go Brittania! And they talked about it. In watching Hindi movies and trying to learn the language a bit, and now learning Welsh I can see many similar words. I had actually seen this spoken about earlier, so let me see if I can find some links to it. Here is the part in the article that talks about it:

In the late 18th century, a Welsh scholar employed by the East India Company, Sir William Jones, discovered that many words in Sanskrit, the language of Hindu holy books, were similar to words in Welsh. Further research, carried out by the German brothers Grimm and others, later revealed that most European languages and some Indian ones have a common ancestor, now known as Indo-European.

Other notable Welsh philologists were missionary David Jones who first put the Malagasy language of Madagascar into writing; John Davies who published the first grammar and dictionary of Tahitian; Dr. David Samuel, who made the first written record of the Maori language of New Zealand. Nearer Wales, Robert Williams compiled the first comprehensive dictionary of the Cornish language, and Bishop John Phillips translated the Book of Common Prayer into Manx.

Posted by: susieq76 31-Jan-2005, 09:32 AM

Here are a few more interesting links:

http://www.cogs.susx.ac.uk/users/larryt/basque.prehistory.html

Very intellectual site, but interesting:

http://www.comp-archaeology.org/18LINGUI.htm

One more:

http://www.ling.ohio-state.edu/~bjoseph/publications/2000indo.pdf

These are some decent ones, some of which go into detail. It is pretty neat, to me. The last one is a PDF file. I will see what else I can check out on the subject. It seems important to know the base of languages in order to understand where they have come from and where they are going. It also helps if you are learning several, like Irish, Gaelic, Welsh, Scots-Gaelic, Breton, etc. since you know root words and such. Kind of like learning Latin and that helping with English, Spanish, French, German, etc.

Posted by: Ivy 31-Jan-2005, 12:29 PM

Here is an interesting bit of info for you... I don't know if this is relevant, but...When Babylon took the judaic empire, the daughter of the Judaic royal house (Tamar) was sent to Ireland (or maybe scotland?) to secure the line and make sure they did not die out (circa 700BC). One of the things she was sent with was the Lia Fail- the "stone of destinies". I have found no reference in Celtic myth as to where the lia Fail came from... I found this in judeo-christian studies.

In middle eastern culture, the Stone of Destiny, or Stone of Fate, (tablet of fate) was the bond of the king to the gods and earth. It gave rules that the king and others should live by to make sure that the People and the Land were cared for in the sight of the gods. A very celtic sentiment if you ask me. The laws or rules were very simplistic and easy to understand on a common sense level, but also very esoteric as well.

The point of interest here, Judea knew of Ireland-enough to send the daughter of their royal house, perhaps other middle eastern countried knew of the isles as well? Certainly later during the reign of Alexander, the British isles would be known to the middle east (circa 300 BC), and who's to say language and ideas were not traded in earlier times? I would be interested to know how close Farsi (Persian) and Welsh are to old Aramaic (the "Lingua Franca" of the middle east for years upon years). Can someone ansewr that question for me?

Peace and Power

Posted by: phoenix07 06-Feb-2005, 02:09 AM

interesting, i am going to read them once i go back to home!!
about your question Ivy! when i was watching the passion of the christ, i realised that aramic language which was spoken in the movie was so close to syrian/lebanese

so , now, any chance of gaelic languages being connected to arabic as well, considering arabic languages vary from an area to another, syrian was the closest to aramic..
i have to look through this as well

Posted by: phoenix07 06-Feb-2005, 02:40 AM

found some couple researchs here

http://www.mnstate.edu/gunarat/languages.pdf

http://www.humnet.ucla.edu/humnet/pies/pdfs/IESV/1/VVI_Gothic_syntax.pdf

i might also go check in my university's library