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Swanny 
Posted: 03-Mar-2004, 03:39 PM
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Man threatened with arrest after taking photos

EAST ST. LOUIS - Fletcher Parker said all he wanted was a few snapshots of the East St. Louis Police Department in action, a force he said he strongly supports.

Instead, he said cops seized his digital camera's disc, which records the images, and threatened him with arrest.

Link to the entire article above.

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maisky 
Posted: 03-Mar-2004, 04:07 PM
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You are right, Sir Swanny. I worry FAR more about Big Brother than I do about terrorists. sad.gif


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birddog20002001 
Posted: 03-Mar-2004, 05:12 PM
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Well, I say that the Gestapo oops I mean police should only have their photo's taken a Glamour Shots that way we can't see their disease.


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andylucy 
Posted: 04-Mar-2004, 02:28 AM
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QUOTE (birddog20002001 @ Mar 3 2004, 04:12 PM)
Well, I say that the Gestapo oops I mean police should only have their photo's taken a Glamour Shots that way we can't see their disease.

Careful about overgeneralizing there, guy. I work with officers who go out every day and put their lives on the line to protect others from the scumbags out there. They could care less about who takes their picture. Well, there is one guy who would like for them to wait until he combs his hair first. biggrin.gif

Seriously, my wife is from Belleville. The police in that area ARE notorious for their, shall we say, extralegal techniques of intimidating the populace. And don't forget, this is Illinois, where you can't even buy a shotgun shell without a government issued permit. But it is not, let me repeat, NOT, how all police officers view the world. There are idiots in every profession, and law enforcement does SEEM to draw more than its fair share. But don't paint all officers with the same brush.

As an example. One of the officers I work with, while on routine patrol last month, noticed something unusual in a residence in the local housing projects. He immediately ran up and kicked in the front door. Did he over-react? The residents didn't think so, because their residence was on fire, and this officer saved their lives and contained the fire (at great personal risk) until the fire department arrived. Did the newspaper or TV even mention this? Nope. Did he care? Nope. He did his job. thumbs_up.gif Huah!

Not all officers are "Gestapo." Not all officers are heroes. Most are just normal guys doing a tough job for low pay and little thanks. Remember that before you start making "Gestapo" allusions.

Just my tuppence.

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gaberlunzie 
Posted: 04-Mar-2004, 07:21 AM
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Ooooh...I always wince when hearing or reading the word "Gestapo"! I'm far from saying the officer did react right - but "Gestapo" is still quite another league, really...being German, I know a lot about it and having ancestors who were active in the "resistance" during that time and some who paid for this with their life...we know about "Gestapo" and "SS" !
Not meant offensive, honestly... smile.gif


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tsargent62 
Posted: 04-Mar-2004, 09:28 AM
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QUOTE (gaberlunzie @ Mar 4 2004, 07:21 AM)
Ooooh...I always wince when hearing or reading the word "Gestapo"! I'm far from saying the officer did react right - but "Gestapo" is still quite another league, really...being German, I know a lot about it and having ancestors who were active in the "resistance" during that time and some who paid for this with their life...we know about "Gestapo" and "SS" !
Not meant offensive, honestly... smile.gif

Gabs, I don't think you have to worry about offending anyone with your reactions to the word "Gestapo". I'm sure you've heard first hand horror stories about them. Growing up in the US, I don't think I have a good appreciation for that kind of thing, and I doubt many other "native" Americans do, either.

Birddog, thanks for defending the police. I have had friends who were cops and were great guys whom I have nothing for respect for. You're right that we have to be careful not to cast them all in the same, negative mold. That's just another form of bigotry, but this time aimed at a profession.

Todd
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maisky 
Posted: 04-Mar-2004, 09:43 AM
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Good point, my friends. thumbs_up.gif
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birddog20002001 
Posted: 04-Mar-2004, 12:18 PM
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Ok good point on my generalization, it was a crude comparison. I have family on both sides of the bars (cops and murderers) and I'm still not always sure whom to trust. At least with the criminals you do have (at lest in my opinion) a more accurate predictor to their actions and reactions in social situations. I for one, do not wish to be protected and served from myself. (I would like to clarify my statements by saying that I do not have any criminal background except 1 failure to reduce speed and 2 driving without insurance all three several years ago and I do have a healthy respect for the law.)
I want to have the freedom to perform all of the SELF destructive activities that I wish to, however I also believe that my rights end where the rights of others begin; and those that do violate the rights and freedoms of others should be prosecuted to the full extent of the law.
In the story, the fact that Nargelenas said "...they must cease even if the officer has no legal basis for such an order." the unrestrained ability to controll a law-abiding citizen frightens me. Also the fact that Chief Matthews is continuing to refuse to return illegally seized private property and stating that Mr. Parker should have been arrested he is clearly allowing his personal opinions of the man to affect his judgement; or even the fact that MSGT Jordan told him falsely that his photographs were illegal.
I think that this article draws a picture of a dangerous situation that is not just an isolated incident, but a regularly ocouring lack of knowledge of the law all around this country by figures in positions of authority.
Now I do sympathise with the dangerous and thankless conditions that the officers work in on a daily basis and the fact that they are not lawyers, but that is no excuse for not knowing the law when they themselves are the first line of defense of the laws of our land.
Respect for justice and law is the only thing that separates us from the unfortunate events in which unfolded in the 1930's and 40's in Germany. When those that protect us in the night are not beholden to the constraints of law they themselves become the monsters that go bump in the night.
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maisky 
Posted: 04-Mar-2004, 02:21 PM
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Birddog is a poet, and he is correct. thumbs_up.gif The problem is a SYMPTOM of the loss of our civil liberties.
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Shadows 
Posted: 04-Mar-2004, 06:58 PM
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We today are a society of those who want privacy and those who want openness! If you do something in public, it belongs to the public, if it is in private , that is where it belongs.

Don't know how many of you ever read the book "1984" it is scarily accurate of todays conditions!

It is the manipulation of all of us to believe the current situations as reported by government, news, church, etc. that should be looked at.

An innocent act can be made to look subversive or anti-social!

Think about it!


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maisky 
Posted: 04-Mar-2004, 07:52 PM
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QUOTE (Shadows @ Mar 4 2004, 06:58 PM)


An innocent act can be made to look subversive or anti-social!

Especially if it really is subversive! laugh.gif
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Mailagnas maqqas Dunaidonas 
Posted: 04-Mar-2004, 08:39 PM
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QUOTE (Shadows @ Mar 4 2004, 06:58 PM)
Don't know how many of you ever read the book "1984" it is scarily accurate of todays conditions!


I read it in high school (1960) and thought it was nothing that could ever happen here--shows how wrong I can be.


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